Super 8, Max 8 and Super 16 comparisons

Post by **Justin Lovell** » Thu Mar 27, 2008 6:26 pm

FYI, may be of interest to you.

http://framediscreet.blogspot.com/

Nice test for you to see how the different formats compare when using the same stock. (Click images for larger versions). FYI Max 8 is a modification made to widen the gate of the camera allowing image to be recorded where sound used to be recorded. In the transfer you are able to 'zoom out' and see more of the image resulting in tighter grain and a 16x9 image area. There are some limitations to this modification though as you're not able to see the extra are in the viewfinder of the camera and certain focal lengths will vignette.

Stock: Kodak 7218 500T
Format: Super 8, Max 8 (super duper 8), Super 16
Cameras: Canon 1014xls S8, Eclair NPR 16mm (lens Zeiss 11.5-115)
Cinematographer: Justin Lovell
Transfer: Justin Lovell @ Frame Discreet

Post by **fastwind** » Thu Mar 27, 2008 6:49 pm

Thanks. I really appreciate your comparison test. What was the shutter angle for the Canon set to? 220 ofr 150?

Post by **Will2** » Thu Mar 27, 2008 7:40 pm

Very nice, thanks for taking the time!

I've noticed more and more that my HD Super 16 transfers from my K3 just look better than when I zoom in on a Standard 16 frame from my Scoopic.

Could be better lenses on the K3, but I just think that extra space does make a difference, for both SD 16:9 transfers and HD.

I wish I could make that Scoopic MS Super 16 without spending crazy money.

Post by **RichardB** » Thu Mar 27, 2008 11:51 pm

Shame about the vignetting on max-8, I was seriously considering it until I realise I'd be robbed of my most used focal length. Super 16 though... 8O

Post by **Scotness** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 9:45 am

Great comparison - a picture paints a thousand words - thanks for posting.

FWIW here's a few words (from the frame size thread)

8mm frame size
width: 4.87 mm
height: 3.68 mm
total: 17.92mm sq

Super 8 frame size
width: 5.68 mm
height: 4.23 mm
total: 24.02 mm sq

Super-dooper 8 frame size
width: 6.41 mm
height: 4.23 mm
total: 27.11 mm sq
(based on extra 13% width - quoted here )

16mm cropped to 16:9 frame size
width: 10.26 mm
height: 5.77 mm
total: 59.20 mm sq

Ultra 16mm frame size
width: 11.8 mm
height: 6.23mm
total: 73.5 mm sq
(based on this comparison of 16mm formats )

16mm frame size
width: 10.26 mm
height: 7.49 mm
total: 76.84 mm sq

Super 16 frame size
width: 12.39 mm
height: 7.49 mm
total: 92.80 mm sq

Scot

Post by **Angus** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:22 pm

Very informative for those able to shoot in the various formats. Thanks.

Post by **reflex** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 4:07 pm

RichardB wrote:Shame about the vignetting on max-8, I was seriously considering it until I realise I'd be robbed of my most used focal length. Super 16 though... 8O

Widening the Super 8 gate produces different results with different camera models, so don't count out widescreen S8 (I can't bring myself to use Pro8mm's Max-8 abbreviation for their "invention" that came along decades after people first tried it).

It's worth trying. At worst, you can always transfer the film at the normal aspect ratio or crop slightly more aggressively.

Post by **StoneBuilder** » Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:55 pm

The Kodachrome music video is interesting. Beautiful colours. These almost chiaroscura images mash well with vintage live Whitesnake.

Post by **avr** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 11:26 pm

Thanks for the link, your blog is awesome.

Post by **T-Scan** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 7:57 pm

Justin- You did a vid for The National! I love that band.

Post by **Plastik** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:32 am

reflex wrote:Widening the Super 8 gate produces different results with different camera models, so don't count out widescreen S8 (I can't bring myself to use Pro8mm's Max-8 abbreviation for their "invention" that came along decades after people first tried it).

It's worth trying. At worst, you can always transfer the film at the normal aspect ratio or crop slightly more aggressively.

Has anyone widened a Nizo 801M? IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢m assuming there would be vignetting.

Post by **Justin Lovell** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:06 pm

Yeah, the national is great!

NIZO S800 super duper 8 sample:
http://framediscreet.com/super8mmsamples.htm#

(bottom right corner- 7217 color treatment- is an _old_ transfer yeesh.. but it shows the vignette on the WIDEST focal length. Also shows movement at the 150 deg shutter and 75 deg. shutter).