New to film - some info please

Post by **acarboni** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 3:51 pm

Hey, everyone- I've been a digital filmmaker for a few years (studied digital media in school with a focus on video and animation), and I've decided to start learning some of the ins and outs of film. I have a pretty decent knowledge of video and still photography.

I just picked up a canon 514xl for a ridiculously cheap price ($20 bundled with a Kodak Retina IIc). The camera's in pretty much mint condition. It's been in cool, dry storage for quite a few years. All the mechanisms seem to be working fine.

So what're the pros/cons of the camera I just got? It seems like the frame rates are a bit "non-standard," and that there are only really "semi-manual" controls, sort of like a prosumer video camera. I've also heard that there's going to be some problem using this with the new 64T film, which if I understand correctly is soon to be the only film available.

Any info you could give me would be great.

Post by **Joe Gioielli** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 4:59 pm

Just to get the ball rolling:

Don't have one myself, but from what I've read, this camera really isn't designed to "read" the 64 film speed. Many cameras weren't. But don't despair, you can use b/w and negative film. I only shoot reversal, but others on the board can help you with using non-reversal stocks.

You may want to consider buying a full manual super 8 camera. This way you have full control of the exposure. And you can shoot reversal. neg, or b/w. They tend to be a little more money, but not overly so. They are gererally cheaper than a VX or a GL.

I'm a regular 8 shooter. You can get very nice little bolex cameras for very little money, and in their day, they were top of the line. Fully manual, good glass. And as film for these cameras are made from 16mm film, as long as there is 16mm, there will be regular 8 film.

So you have lots of options, film shooting is great and it will also improve your abilties with your video. Have fun with it.

Joe

Post by **super8man** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 5:27 pm

Check out my site for more information...should help you in your choices...

Post by **Patrick** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 5:30 pm

Ektachrome 64T won't be the last remaining film stock in super 8. Though it is currently the only colour reversal film in this format. As Joe pointed out, there are other options for film types offered by Kodak for super 8. They include two black and white reversal films (medium speed and fast) and two colour negative films (both fast speed.)

Post by **onsuper8** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 6:15 pm

The full list of available Super 8 stocks is available on the Film Stock A to Z page of http://www.onsuper8.org - there are surprisingly more than you'd think of all types colour, black & white, reversal and negative.

Post by **super8man** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 6:34 pm

Hey Giles, where's your avatar?

Post by **tlatosmd** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 7:18 pm

onsuper8.org is still lacking Fuji's Velvia 50D sliced and perfed by GK Film and put into carts by Wittner. It can't be an excuse it ain't available yet because both Wittnerchromes ain't yet either.

Post by **gianni1** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 8:05 pm

I've got a Canon 310XL which is similar to 514XL... One stop faster lens, but no 9fps... Great low light cameras, fine with the 100 or 200 speed films indoors or outdoors between dusk and dawn. Not good for fast action vampire fights unless you like the blurr...

They lack the 24fps & 18o degree shutter, the XL's are 220 degrees. Designed as movie point and shoots, you can forget the tripod but will still need to adjust focus and zoom. Light and tiny, they are great for tight or crowded spots and not be noticed by bystanders or the authorities.

This cam doesn't pust the slow, methodical envelope, it's buttons are the fast changing and flexible setups. Not too noisy, and may work (you may be able to test it out) with some of the video wide angle conversion lenses.

Gianni

Post by **acarboni** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 1:43 am

Thanks for all the responses!

I'm aware that it's a fairly limited camera. The gentleman I got it from has been an amateur photographer all his life and decided to get rid of a bunch of his old equipment. I went over to his place to pick up the camera for $15, wound up spending the day looking at some great old equipment and talking shop, and left with the camera and beautiful Kodak Retina IIc for free.

I'm going to run some tests with it and see how I look the look of the different super 8 stocks. If I dig it, I'll probably move up to another camera. For right now I'm just testing the waters.

Anyone know where I might be able to find the manual for this camera online? I've found the 514xl-s manual in a number of places, but not for the straight xl.

Post by **super8man** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:00 am

My Retina IIc came with the Ektar F2.0 lens - simply incredible performance...the bellows are perfect and the results would definitely give the tessar a run for its money...

Post by **acarboni** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:17 am

It's a beautiful camera, for sure. I'm a little intimidated by it because my previous still camera was a Pentax K-1000. I've never worked without a built-in light meter before.

What type of film do you use in your Retina and what do you set the film type for?

Post by **sophocle** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:31 am

If you end up exposing s8 incorrectly, you may be disappointed with the format prematurely.

Often people with video experience give up too quickly.

I have often compared filming in s8 to shooting large format still--both require thought and patience before the results turn from acceptable to impressive.

If you do gun & run type shooting, then video is better then s8, and 35mm is better then 4x5.

Post by **acarboni** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:37 am

sophocle wrote:If you end up exposing s8 incorrectly, you may be disappointed with the format prematurely.

Valid point.

I'm going to learn all I can about the camera itself and the film stock I'm using before I start shooting. I plan on shooting a few rolls under different conditions, but first I'm going to shoot a few in daylight with daylight stock at different settings just to make sure I'm shooting correctly. Though with so few settings on this camera, there aren't many variables for me to play with.

Post by **super8man** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 3:03 am

acarboni wrote:It's a beautiful camera, for sure. I'm a little intimidated by it because my previous still camera was a Pentax K-1000. I've never worked without a built-in light meter before.

What type of film do you use in your Retina and what do you set the film type for?

I regularly use Kodak UC400 and have done so with the Retina. However, I feel these cameras deserve slide film to truly complete the retro thing (a fuji reversal is in order for it I think). I love print film in my modern nikkors though!

Post by **tlatosmd** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:56 am

acarboni wrote:Anyone know where I might be able to find the manual for this camera online? I've found the 514xl-s manual in a number of places, but not for the straight xl.

This site's ftp should be back soon where lots of manuals are located.