Airport Security Paranoia and Film Cement???!!!

[Mitch Perkins]

The terrorists should never have been given the ego-trip of it being described as a "war". They see it as validation.

I think the validation they get is anytime they are mentioned in the media at all.

Gosh everything would be better if these annoying Arabs would just sit back and let us demarcate their borders and prop up brutal regimes for maximum unrest so we could get the oil cheap and keep driving around to the mall or just y'know, nowhere in particular. Anything but just don't ask me to think about what's actually going on or to change my lifestyle.

Ah, the good old days...y'know, the crusades!

Mitch

[aj]

The terrorists should never have been given the ego-trip of it being described as a "war". They see it as validation.

I think the validation they get is anytime they are mentioned in the media at all. My late father used to work in broadcast as a field engineer. He did that for the better part of 50+ years. Based on what he saw,
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Roger

Things don't stay secret for long in Washington (DC). Unless it is something in the skunkworks of the military.

How could such a nation wide scheme with 10.000s of unbound people involved and knowledgeable about it remain secret? I find this hard to believe in a country which reports on complete nonsense facts of persons and where complot theories seem to be a general hobby and belief.

The only underreported thing here (Netherlands) is suicides. These are generally not reported or only in three vague sentences. It is generally best not to bring such ideas to readers/viewers as it could lead to new suicide.

[Angus]

The terrorists should never have been given the ego-trip of it being described as a "war". They see it as validation.

I think the validation they get is anytime they are mentioned in the media at all.

Gosh everything would be better if these annoying Arabs would just sit back and let us demarcate their borders and prop up brutal regimes for maximum unrest so we could get the oil cheap and keep driving around to the mall or just y'know, nowhere in particular. Anything but just don't ask me to think about what's actually going on or to change my lifestyle.

Ah, the good old days...y'know, the crusades!

Mitch

I don't think anyone suggested that.

Nor did myself or Roger equate terrorists with Arabs....

[Evan Kubota]

"How could such a nation wide scheme with 10.000s of unbound people involved and knowledgeable about it remain secret?"

Exactly... you have to have a lot more confidence in the competence of the government than I do to entertain those absurd conspiracy theories. They can't even manage to keep track of which citizens are alive or dead and match that with voting registration, much less keep anything big and secret under wraps.

[MovieStuff]

The terrorists should never have been given the ego-trip of it being described as a "war". They see it as validation.

I think the validation they get is anytime they are mentioned in the media at all.

Gosh everything would be better if these annoying Arabs would just sit back and let us demarcate their borders and prop up brutal regimes for maximum unrest so we could get the oil cheap and keep driving around to the mall or just y'know, nowhere in particular. Anything but just don't ask me to think about what's actually going on or to change my lifestyle.

Ah, the good old days...y'know, the crusades!

Mitch

I never said anything about Arabs, Mitch. The Oklahoma City bombing was also a terrorist act and, like all terrorist acts, was a ploy to get attention on a world stage through the use of violence. I am against any sort of violence that is uncalled for, whether by them or us.

But while I do not condone our present government nor our presence or actions in the mideast, the idea that the U.S. gets all its oil from the Saudis is a well worn myth often used to prop up weak political arguments. In reality, EIA figures show that Saudi oil represents only 12% of our import source. The largest single source of our oil (about 18+%) actually comes from Canada. Canada also has the second largest oil reserves on the planet, over 75% more than Kuwait, and second only to the Saudis. I don't see the U.S. demarcating your borders and propping up your government, just to get better prices at the pump here which, considering Canada has an estimated 99% dependency on the US market, would be easier to do than waging war half way around the world.

I used to think that what was going on in the Mideast was about oil. Now I believe it is a war based on opposing religious fundamentalists, here and there. Frankly I find that's even scarier because, unlike oil, you can't buy someone out of a belief.

Roger

[MovieStuff]

I find this hard to believe in a country which reports on complete nonsense facts of persons and where complot theories seem to be a general hobby and belief.

You're thinking about the way things are now, and I agree, but my father retired over 15 years ago. There was no modern internet in the 70's, no chat rooms or forums to discuss conspiracy theories on. Also, as world satellite news made things more connected, events became more easily known by the public right after the event or, sometimes, even as they happened. As I said in my previous post, the internet also changed everything. You can't keep a secret now but back then the media was more cooperative with the government about things like this.

Roger

[aj]

Ah, the good old days...y'know, the crusades!

Mitch

The crusades went by sailing ship and on foot or horse.
They didn't seize or force any oil-deals

[ccortez]

I used to think that what was going on in the Mideast was about oil. Now I believe it is a war based on opposing religious fundamentalists, here and there. Frankly I find that's even scarier because, unlike oil, you can't buy someone out of a belief.

It would certainly be easier to purchase the oil on the open market than to wage a war like this to procure it. I used to believe (maybe still do?) that domination of the dollar in the pricing of the most critical world resource had something to do with the US motivation. But I agree with Roger, except that I think it's even more fundamental than fundamentalism -- most important, as always, is straight-ahead racism and hatred.

[MovieStuff]

I used to think that what was going on in the Mideast was about oil. Now I believe it is a war based on opposing religious fundamentalists, here and there. Frankly I find that's even scarier because, unlike oil, you can't buy someone out of a belief.

It would certainly be easier to purchase the oil on the open market than to wage a war like this to procure it.

Absolutely. Oil is just a pretext. I firmly believe that our government is being very shrewed. As long as everyone thinks it's a fight about oil, then that is the context of all the debates. People often will temper their opinions when faced with making personal choices, like being able to drive their kids to work or take long family vacations in the RV. But I think a country founded on religious freedom would not swallow the idea of waging a war based soley on religious differences. Some might, but I think it would be a harder concept to sell because it goes against our basic human nature, while greed is an unfortunate human condition that can be manipulated more easily. "Practice the religion of your own choice but don't take away my right to drive to church."

I used to believe (maybe still do?) that domination of the dollar in the pricing of the most critical world resource had something to do with the US motivation.

A red herring. If you take into account inflation, today's gas is actually cheaper than it was in 1981.

But I agree with Roger, except that I think it's even more fundamental than fundamentalism -- most important, as always, is straight-ahead racism and hatred.

Yes, I am afraid you may be right. Very troubling.

Roger

[Angus]

Ah, the good old days...y'know, the crusades!

Mitch

The crusades went by sailing ship and on foot or horse.
They didn't seize or force any oil-deals

The crusades do point to religion itself being the problem however...

[jean]

Ah, the good old days...y'know, the crusades!

Mitch

The crusades went by sailing ship and on foot or horse.
They didn't seize or force any oil-deals

The crusades do point to religion itself being the problem however...

The crusades were a good organized form of robbery, the search-and-destroy was merely a side effect.

[mojohey]

I see that BA has just made an announcement regarding the present terror threat..

It goes as follows...

" I AIN'T GETTING ON NO PLANE FOOL!!!"

Bring back the A Team.... oops sorry wrong thread.

[Angus]

Most of the restrictions have today, thankfully, been lifted.

You can now take laptops, music players, cameras etc on board planes...but no liquids except baby food and no cosmetics/toiletries. A bit of a bugger for those who like to shave after a transatlantic flight but hardly the end of the world...

[Mitch Perkins]

I think the validation they get is anytime they are mentioned in the media at all.

Gosh everything would be better if these annoying Arabs would just sit back and let us demarcate their borders and prop up brutal regimes for maximum unrest so we could get the oil cheap and keep driving around to the mall or just y'know, nowhere in particular. Anything but just don't ask me to think about what's actually going on or to change my lifestyle.

Ah, the good old days...y'know, the crusades!

Mitch

I never said anything about Arabs, Mitch.

Oh good. Just checking.

The Oklahoma City bombing was also a terrorist act and, like all terrorist acts, was a ploy to get attention on a world stage through the use of violence. I am against any sort of violence that is uncalled for, whether by them or us.

"uncalled for" is perspective-dependant.
"shock and awe" is a ploy to get attention on a world stage through the use of violence.
Jesse James - hero or terrorist?
Who coined the term "terrorist" anyhow?

But while I do not condone our present government nor our presence or actions in the mideast, the idea that the U.S. gets all its oil from the Saudis is a well worn myth often used to prop up weak political arguments. In reality, EIA figures show that Saudi oil represents only 12% of our import source. The largest single source of our oil (about 18+%) actually comes from Canada. Canada also has the second largest oil reserves on the planet, over 75% more than Kuwait, and second only to the Saudis. I don't see the U.S. demarcating your borders and propping up your government, just to get better prices at the pump here which, considering Canada has an estimated 99% dependency on the US market, would be easier to do than waging war half way around the world.

Whatever - it's not just the US [don't flatter yourself]; it's the west - it's not just oil; it's access to a vast potential market - which worldview will dominate...all of it. The so-called "terrorists" have the least power and the most to lose.

I used to think that what was going on in the Mideast was about oil. Now I believe it is a war based on opposing religious fundamentalists, here and there. Frankly I find that's even scarier because, unlike oil, you can't buy someone out of a belief.

Roger

Nor can you bomb them out of it. OTOH, it's pretty clear the west is run by corporations, which don't believe in anything but cash - if they can whip up support for their agenda [getting more cash] by appealing to right-wing religious nutters, then so be it. As long as capitalism runs un-checked in the west, we'll have outlaws fighting the good fight against it. Now, if we could just have some reasonable capitalism, then who knows...

Mitch

[reflex]

The largest single source of our oil (about 18+%) actually comes from Canada. Canada also has the second largest oil reserves on the planet, over 75% more than Kuwait, and second only to the Saudis. I don't see the U.S. demarcating your borders and propping up your government, just to get better prices at the pump here which, considering Canada has an estimated 99% dependency on the US market, would be easier to do than waging war half way around the world.

You guys won the war against Canada. I just wish your government would quit treating us like halfwit cousins. We have accepted the American occupation quite passively -- no home-grown terrorists have yet to blow up a "Canadian" Wal-Mart, McDonald's, Home Depot, Wendy's, Krispy Kreme or Chevrolet dealership (they're cruel enough to stick little maple leaves into the corporate logos in an attept to make us feel a tad better). We cheerfully buy Boeings for our airlines, F-18's for the military, and so on. ;)

Gasoline refined from Canadian oil costs less in the USA than in Canada. I suspect the difference is primarily taxation -- we have significantly lower population per mile of paved road.

Besides, a vast amount of "Canadian" oil is pumped and refined by subsidiaries of American companies. In addition, the NAFTA ensures that it will be made available to American refineries at prices comparable to the domestic market.