How many of you guys have equipment with broken nylon gears?

[slashmaster]

I'm still trying to get my business off the ground. I'm thinking about buying a gear cutter set so I can make replacement gears for cameras or projectors that might have cracked or stripped teeth on nylon gears. Was trying to get an idea of how much demand there might be for it? If so what do you have and what gear is stripped or broken? https://www.facebook.com/ShildFilm

[BAC]

You may want to look at the link below. I think they're only making projector parts though.

http://shop.van-eck.net/?_globalsearch=pp-00

http://van-eck.net/itable.php?lang=en&s ... &type=none

[slashmaster]

Yeah BAC, prime example! Nylon and plastic will shrink with time. When they put those worm gears on at the factory with a proper interference fit, it became too much of an interference fit with time and split the worm gear. I use to have a bell and howell 16mm projector with a split worm gear like that which I was worried might snap every time I started the projector.

[Will2]

Lost a Kodak Analyst Super 8 to disintegrating plastic gears but nothing else so far.

[slashmaster]

Lost a Kodak Analyst Super 8 to disintegrating plastic gears but nothing else so far.

That one looks like the viewfinder is separate from the lens? Or is it a reflex?

[Will2]

Lost a Kodak Analyst Super 8 to disintegrating plastic gears but nothing else so far.

That one looks like the viewfinder is separate from the lens? Or is it a reflex?

The viewfinder is horrible and it is not reflex. When you slide the "zoom switch" it does zoom both the view finder and camera lens at the same time. It's just there for framing.

[slashmaster]

Lost a Kodak Analyst Super 8 to disintegrating plastic gears but nothing else so far.

That one looks like the viewfinder is separate from the lens? Or is it a reflex?

[img]<a class="vglnk" href="http://www.digicamhistory.com/Kodak_Analyst_1a.jpg[/img" rel="nofollow"><span>http</span><span>://</span><span>www</span><span>.</span><span>digicamhistory</span><span>.</span><span>com</span><span>/</span><span>Kodak</span><span>_</span><span>Analyst</span><span>_</span><span>1a</span><span>.</span><span>jpg</span><span>[/</span><span>img</span></a>]

The viewfinder is horrible and it is not reflex. When you slide the "zoom switch" it does zoom both the view finder and camera lens at the same time. It's just there for framing.

I know what you mean, I have an Argus like that which I still have yet to use. Must give a real good image since you don't lose any quality going through a prism.

[Will2]

Must give a real good image since you don't lose any quality going through a prism.

Not really...pretty sure it's a crappy plastic lens. It's really made for security or seeing something happen over time; it can't actually shoot in 18 or 24 fps; fastest is one frame per second I think. Fun for time-lapse but not a great picture.

This was a bad transfer but here's one of the few things I used it for:

http://www.will1.com/staging/

[slashmaster]

Must give a real good image since you don't lose any quality going through a prism.

Not really...pretty sure it's a crappy plastic lens. It's really made for security or seeing something happen over time; it can't actually shoot in 18 or 24 fps; fastest is one frame per second I think. Fun for time-lapse but not a great picture.

This was a bad transfer but here's one of the few things I used it for:

<a class="vglnk" href="http://www.will1.com/staging/" rel="nofollow"><span>http</span><span>://</span><span>www</span><span>.</span><span>will1</span><span>.</span><span>com</span><span>/</span><span>staging</span><span>/</span></a>

Yeah, could judge better from a better transfer. How clean is the lens? Was it zoomed all the way in or out when you made this? I think I'm going to try running mine the way it is and if I don't like it I'll convert it into a C-mount camera, these are nice cameras to convert to c-mount when you don't have the complication of the prism like that. Nice it doesn't have the complication of a zoom motor either!

[Mmechanic]

There must nothing be plastic about film but the film itself.

Everybody expects film manufacturers to produce good films. Their machines are made of metals, big, expensive, long lasting. But then, among the various formats, Super-8 and Single-8 apparatuses are full of plastic. There have been all-metal cameras and projectors for 9.5mm film, for 16mm film, for the Double-Eight film, even for DS-8. There have been a few all-metal cameras and projectors for S-8. A few.

It is correct that plastic parts have been used with 16mm equipment. The years have gone by and as all plastics shrink and decay (it’s the nature of polymolecules), such gears crack. Ozone and heat, both enemies to polymolecules, are present with electric motors and incandescent lamps. It’s fatal.

Mechanically, a TQ from the sixties is in no way better than an older Filmosound. Something happened with the Bell & Howell Co. in 1958. Something happened with everybody back then. I’d never buy anything younger than mid-fifties from BH.

Eumig Mark S series projectors have motor mounts that disintegrate. Paillard-Bolex S series projectors have whole gear sets made of plastic and anti-vibratory mounts that become tired. Their housing is made of plywood. Such machines can be refurbished, improved, but not everybody wants to pay for such endeavours. Mechanically, the Paillard-Bolex S are of very high quality.

I’d like to compare the Super-8 and Single-8 products with the Compact Cassette recorders. Who expects a cheap tape recorder from the seventies to still function properly? Honestly, we don’t, do we? So throw all that trash to the used electronic goods. As long as there’s film we’ll be best off with all-metal gear. I praise the classic spring-drive movie cameras. I praise everything not Super/Single-8.

[slashmaster]

There must nothing be plastic about film but the film itself.

Everybody expects film manufacturers to produce good films. Their machines are made of metals, big, expensive, long lasting. But then, among the various formats, Super-8 and Single-8 apparatuses are full of plastic. There have been all-metal cameras and projectors for 9.5mm film, for 16mm film, for the Double-Eight film, even for DS-8. There have been a few all-metal cameras and projectors for S-8. A few.

It is correct that plastic parts have been used with 16mm equipment. The years have gone by and as all plastics shrink and decay (it’s the nature of polymolecules), such gears crack. Ozone and heat, both enemies to polymolecules, are present with electric motors and incandescent lamps. It’s fatal.

Mechanically, a TQ from the sixties is in no way better than an older Filmosound. Something happened with the Bell & Howell Co. in 1958. Something happened with everybody back then. I’d never buy anything younger than mid-fifties from BH.

Eumig Mark S series projectors have motor mounts that disintegrate. Paillard-Bolex S series projectors have whole gear sets made of plastic and anti-vibratory mounts that become tired. Their housing is made of plywood. Such machines can be refurbished, improved, but not everybody wants to pay for such endeavours. Mechanically, the Paillard-Bolex S are of very high quality.

I’d like to compare the Super-8 and Single-8 products with the Compact Cassette recorders. Who expects a cheap tape recorder from the seventies to still function properly? Honestly, we don’t, do we? So throw all that trash to the used electronic goods. As long as there’s film we’ll be best off with all-metal gear. I praise the classic spring-drive movie cameras. I praise everything not Super/Single-8.

This is similar to how I think of it! I don't like it when cameras and projectors have plastic bodies. There is an excuse for plastic gears on the sound cameras and projectors because you don't want to have to listen to the noise of the gears. But as for silent ones I certainly prefer all metal.

It's very interesting that you say this because you can say super 8's a bad choice because there are so few that don't have plastic bodies or nylon gears, regular 8 is a bad choice because it's like driving a car with super wide tires on one side and very skinny donuts on the other, you get very uneven wear on the projectors gate! What do you do once one side of the film gate wears down?

[Mmechanic]

Never in my life have I encountered anything like that. Have you?

There may have been projectors with lesser film gates but most have hard chrome plated or hardened steel aperture plates and pressure plates. Cameras, too. Really no need to worry

Revere 88, Bell & Howell Filmo 8, Eumig P8, Paillard-Bolex 18-5, Noris, Bauer T 10, Sekonic, Bell Koon, Keystone, Tandberg Elite 8 Sound, Eumig Mark S, Beaulieu, Bell & Howell Autoload, Kodak Sound 8, Ampro A 8, Paillard-Bolex M 8, there are so many useful products around for a handful of dollars. Still, not all of them are free from plastic.

I don’t think that metal worm gears are noisier than plastic ones. A projector’s noise comes from the fan mostly and the claw shuttle. The Eumig P8 is an example for that. An old Bell & Howell Filmo 8 that I cleaned and lubricated fresh purred like a cat. Kodak Pageant is an example of a noisy sound 16mm machine. It’s got a wooden housing and too long a film gate. What vibes!

[slashmaster]

Never in my life have I encountered anything like that. Have you?

There may have been projectors with lesser film gates but most have hard chrome plated or hardened steel aperture plates and pressure plates. Cameras, too. Really no need to worry

Revere 88, Bell & Howell Filmo 8, Eumig P8, Paillard-Bolex 18-5, Noris, Bauer T 10, Sekonic, Bell Koon, Keystone, Tandberg Elite 8 Sound, Eumig Mark S, Beaulieu, Bell & Howell Autoload, Kodak Sound 8, Ampro A 8, Paillard-Bolex M 8, there are so many useful products around for a handful of dollars. Still, not all of them are free from plastic.

I don’t think that metal worm gears are noisier than plastic ones. A projector’s noise comes from the fan mostly and the claw shuttle. The Eumig P8 is an example for that. An old Bell & Howell Filmo 8 that I cleaned and lubricated fresh purred like a cat. Kodak Pageant is an example of a noisy sound 16mm machine. It’s got a wooden housing and too long a film gate. What vibes!

Sure have had that problem! I've got one of these https://img0.etsystatic.com/000/0/53999 ... 357644.jpg The film not only wore down the film rail on the unsprocketed side, it also cut grooves into the film guides! I have a cheaper version of this projector which I use for parts so that is how I repaired it. Every time I run it I open the gate and run my finger down both sides to lubricate it. I don't know what I'm going to do next time I wear the gate out, It would be a lot tougher to make one of those than a few gears, but for now I've got a good one! Not as good looking as a Revere 88 I know but the gates easier to clean. The ironic thing about this one is it has a plastic squirrel cage fan, the later ones have a metal one. Still trying to figure out which one flows more air, I might swap them out.

Oh yeah, I also have an elmo 16-cl where the film guides seem to be porcelain? The film cut grooves into the guides and also put a fair amount of wear on the film rails. Sometimes the grooves on the bottom film guides lift the film off of the rails therefore making the picture go slightly out of focus. So I tried to polish the grooves out with a dremel and I shattered one of the guides! Don't know what I'm going to do now, It was a porcelain film guide pad glued to stainless steel. Was thinking about making a stainless pad to weld on but porcelain would take more wear wouldn't it?

[Will2]

This is similar to how I think of it! I don't like it when cameras and projectors have plastic bodies. There is an excuse for plastic gears on the sound cameras and projectors because you don't want to have to listen to the noise of the gears. But as for silent ones I certainly prefer all metal.

It's very interesting that you say this because you can say super 8's a bad choice because there are so few that don't have plastic bodies or nylon gears, regular 8 is a bad choice because it's like driving a car with super wide tires on one side and very skinny donuts on the other, you get very uneven wear on the projectors gate! What do you do once one side of the film gate wears down?

Inexpensive Super 8 cameras have lots of plastic for one simple reason; they are cheap to make. That's it. It's why the format was as successful as it was because it put cameras in the hands of people that couldn't otherwise afford them or simply wouldn't think it was worth it to purchase a well made but 2-3x as expensive camera. In a way we should be grateful because it expanded the use of the format and made it last until today. Kodak knew from the 20's that the secret was making cheap cameras so people would buy the expensive (yet cheap to make in big quantities) film.

[slashmaster]

Inexpensive Super 8 cameras have lots of plastic for one simple reason; they are cheap to make. That's it. It's why the format was as successful as it was because it put cameras in the hands of people that couldn't otherwise afford them or simply wouldn't think it was worth it to purchase a well made but 2-3x as expensive camera. In a way we should be grateful because it expanded the use of the format and made it last until today. Kodak knew from the 20's that the secret was making cheap cameras so people would buy the expensive (yet cheap to make in big quantities) film.

Well said! Now that they've tried it and know that they like it, someone like me can make some of those cameras and projectors a little more able to stand the test of time...