Rating Tri-X / Shooting Tri-X with Nizo 801 macro

Post by **Guy Bennett** » Thu Jun 09, 2005 9:35 am

Another newbie question...

I just purchased a Nizo 801 macro, and am going to shoot some test film this afternoon. I'll start out with Plus-X and Tri-X, and have a couple of questions about rating the latter for correct exposure. Apologies in advance if this horse has already been beaten dead...

The Nizo manual says that the camera can expose B&W film up to 100 ASA, but Tri-X is rated 200. How will the camera "read" the film cartridge, i.e. at what ASA will it rate it? Will I have to underexpose the film to achieve correct exposure?

Also: if the cartridge doesn't engage the built-in filter (which I've read it does not), can I manually engage the filter using the camera's filter button by switching it to the "lamp" (as opposed to "sun) setting? If so, this should reduce the film to about 160 ASA, I believe, which is still more than the camera can accept, again according to the manual. If this is the case, what do I do?

In addition to the above, is there anything else I should be thinking about when planning to shoot Tri-X with the Nizo 801?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Post by **Splee** » Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:37 am

I think even the most basic cameras cope pretty well with Tri-X, so I don't think you'll have any problems. I have a Canon AF310XL, which sets the exposure to Tungsten 160/Daylight 100 - the filter on this camera is completely manual, so I just flip the switch to Tungsten and shoot away. It works very well, and the finished film is pretty well exposed both indoors and out.

So, you just need to make sure the filter is disengaged, and you should be fine.

Lee

Post by **sonickel** » Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:37 am

I've got a Nizo 481 (non-macro) that's very similar to the Nizo 801. If you rely on the internal lightmeter without making any correction, your film will come out horribly overexposed. (I made this very expensive mistake myself). However, I'm not aware of any compensationary methods of metering (ie knocking off 2 fstops from every shot).

I recommend getting a hand held lightmeter - a second hand Gossen LunaPro, or LunaSix has a Cine meter on it, and is relatively cheap. Learning how to use one will stand you in good stead for "upgrading" to 16mm later... as well as give you better control over the image.

Best of luck :twisted:

Post by **sonickel** » Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:39 am

I've got a Nizo 481 (non-macro) that's very similar to the Nizo 801. If you rely on the internal lightmeter without making any correction, your film will come out horribly overexposed. (I made this very expensive mistake myself). However, I'm not aware of any compensationary methods of metering (ie knocking off 2 fstops from every shot).

I recommend getting a hand held lightmeter - a second hand Gossen LunaPro, or LunaSix has a Cine meter on it, and is relatively cheap. Learning how to use one will stand you in good stead for "upgrading" to 16mm later... as well as give you better control over the image.

Best of luck :twisted:

Post by **Taqi** » Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:10 am

I've shot many cartridges of TriX using a Nizo Pro and have experienced no exposure problems when using the internal light meter. I'm not sure how the camera rates it (I would guess 160 is the most probable.. but you would need to measure the notch on the cartridge). You can manually create a filter notch on the cartridge using slim nosed pliers (just compare the cartridge with eg a K40 one and mark up the relevant place). Otherwise you might wish to use a yellow or orange filter on the lens if appropriate.

Does the manual say that the camera can expose B&W film up to 100 ASA? My recollection is that the manual gives a list of film speeds available which includes to 100 figure for B&W - this is not the same thing as saying the camera can only rate up to 100 asa.

But the advice is (you guessed it) shoot a test roll!

PS Plus X is a far better stock IMHO...

Post by **xeno_basso** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 12:43 pm

sonickel wrote:I recommend getting a hand held lightmeter - a second hand Gossen LunaPro, or LunaSix has a Cine meter on it, and is relatively cheap. Learning how to use one will stand you in good stead for "upgrading" to 16mm later... as well as give you better control over the image.

sonickel...I have just that meter and was outside today doing some tests. I can't believe the discrepancy between the LunaPro and the Nizo!

Can you share your experiences? I'm particularly interested in what compensation factor I should dial into the Gossen to take into account things like light loss, zoome lenses, refraction, prisms, etc.

xb

Post by **Justin Lovell** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 4:19 pm

make sure you have your light meter set for a 150 degree shutter (or 75 depending on how your camera is setup) also add 1/3 stop-1 full stop because of the beam splitting prism stealing light.

if you're set on 24fps mode, then it assumes you are shooting with a 180 deg shutter.

justin
frame discreet
8mm.film.transfer.house
http://www.justinlovell.com

Post by **steve hyde** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 6:16 pm

....if you are generating test reels, I suggest playing around with over exposure a bit. I have been shooting a lot of B&W this summer (some with a Nizo S56) and I have found that my Nizo tends to underexpose the film. Try overexposing some takes. I personally love the way Tri-X looks when it is over exposed - you get dreamy halos around highlights sometimes. On the other hand - if you underexpose you get really dark shadows.

Steve

Post by **ccortez** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 7:58 pm

steve hyde wrote: I personally love the way Tri-X looks when it is over exposed - you get dreamy halos around highlights sometimes. On the other hand - if you underexpose you get really dark shadows.

a man after my own heart.

Post by **steve hyde** » Sat Jul 30, 2005 8:10 pm

ccortez wrote:
steve hyde wrote: I personally love the way Tri-X looks when it is over exposed - you get dreamy halos around highlights sometimes. On the other hand - if you underexpose you get really dark shadows.
a man after my own heart.

Yeah... +1 +2 - just open it up and let some light onto the film. It's cinema. And it is all about light. The problem with shadows is that you can't see anything!!! This makes me sleepy. It begins to look a lot like the back of my eyelids

Steve

Sat Jul 30, 2005 9:21 pm

I've been wondering about this, too. So, just to be clear:

On a 40/160-only camera, Tri-X is read as 160, so a filter notch must be cut and the filter activated. This rates and exposes the film at 100 ASA regardless of the type of lighting. I'm assuming this because the back of the Tri-X (7278) box gives different speeds for the film under tungsten light and daylight without the filter. However, it says: "Adding the daylight filter will change the EI to 100...", apparently regardless of the type of lighting.

Correct?

Website · Post by **BigBeaner** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 5:29 am

From one Bennett to another, I really like Tri-X and the results I shot in daylight with a cheap Bell and Howell camera came out pretty good, maybe a little overexposed but I think thats because the camera is an XL.

Still gave it a very moody feel to it.

Post by **Evan Kubota** » Sun Jul 31, 2005 6:07 am

"I have been shooting a lot of B&W this summer (some with a Nizo S56) and I have found that my Nizo tends to underexpose the film."

FWIW, my Nizo significantly overexposed the K40 I shot with it... I was somewhat surprised. Not unusable, but something to watch for. I would probably meter for the highlights, and maybe even knock a half stop off that number.