Upcoming consumer HD camera on minidv tapes

Post by **MovieStuff** » Sun Jan 26, 2003 6:22 pm

crimsonson wrote:This is simillar to DV 24p camera - Panasonic's DVX100. Now Avid, In-Sync, Vegas and FCP support or will support 24p DV.

I was under the impression that the DVX100 recorded 24p to standard 60i with a built in 3:2 pulldown. As such, the tapes can be played in any miniDV deck for use with any standard NLE system. By contrast, the Sony HD 24p system actually records in 24p proprietary with no 3:2 pulldown, so you need special decks for playback and special NLE for editing.

Roger

Post by **crimsonson** » Mon Jan 27, 2003 1:33 am

MovieStuff wrote: I was under the impression that the DVX100 recorded 24p to standard 60i with a built in 3:2 pulldown. As such, the tapes can be played in any miniDV deck for use with any standard NLE system. By contrast, the Sony HD 24p system actually records in 24p proprietary with no 3:2 pulldown, so you need special decks for playback and special NLE for editing.

Roger

It does. What I am refering to is native 24p editing. Although, any DV NLE can use DVX100 footage, editing in 60i instead of native 24p allows the pulldown cadence to be broken during every cut. A native 24p timeline allows you to also deal with only 24 frames instead of 30, thus less render time.

Post by **MovieStuff** » Mon Jan 27, 2003 1:42 am

crimsonson wrote: Although, any DV NLE can use DVX100 footage, editing in 60i instead of native 24p allows the pulldown cadence to be broken during every cut. A native 24p timeline allows you to also deal with only 24 frames instead of 30, thus less render time.

Okay, but when you digitize the footage from the DVX100, it already has the 3:2 pulldown built in. Do the NLE systems you speak of automatically skip the pulldown frames during capture or do you have to render out new footage with the pulldown frames removed or does the NLE software simply ignore the existence of the pulldown frames during editing?

Roger

Post by **S8 Booster** » Mon Jan 27, 2003 2:40 am

Lucas Lightfeat wrote: S8 Booster - Did Indie really do that? I seem to remember that scene - didn't he carry a zippo? That is quite funny!
Lucas

I do not remember which one this was (name) but i think IJ dived into some underground canal under a library? in Venice trying to escape the persuaders. He vaded around for a long time with flaming torch in his hand and suddenly he noticed that the water smelled PETROL. (after some time mind you). Great idea: Get away a little and drop the torch (might have been the zippo to "light my fire" without beeing blown to the eternal hunting fields and not set his own clothing afire. And the staff in the library: Never smelt the petrol from the "cellar". Can you imagine that.

With some reservation for a disintegrating memory this kind of low tech work makes me interest collapse like a Hindenburger instantly. Better on free TV than pay cinema. :evil:

I think Sean Connory played his father in this film.

Where did the brilliance from Buster Keaton and Charlie Chaplin go?

R

Post by **crimsonson** » Mon Jan 27, 2003 4:56 am

MovieStuff wrote: Okay, but when you digitize the footage from the DVX100, it already has the 3:2 pulldown built in. Do the NLE systems you speak of automatically skip the pulldown frames during capture or do you have to render out new footage with the pulldown frames removed or does the NLE software simply ignore the existence of the pulldown frames during editing?

Roger

They ignore the fields and recreate the pulldown frames [C frame]. Supposedly Pana *flagged* the repeat frames/fields [like the way you would flag a 16:9 DV stream]. However, even if they did not, modern NLEs are capable of detecting the original frames themselves. These NLEs would ignore the frames and write a 24 frame DV file to your drive.

There is a $99 utility that does it for your seperately by the company DV Filmmaker.

Reverse pulldown is also likely. When you are ready to output your 24p timeline, you instruct the NLE to double the fields for you right before the DV stream is sent to the deck or cam, since all DV cams and decks are expecting 60i.

BTW - DVX100 includes a 24p system called 24p Advance. As you know the regular pulldown [2:3] frame consist of 3 fields from 2 seperate frames. For quality freaks there is 24p Advance [2:3:3:2], thus removal of the pulldown frame will not cost recompression on the frames involved like traditional 2:3 pulldown.