Super-8 List-Cameras that don't read Ektachrome 64 correctly

[Alex]

I thought it would be useful to come up with a list of cameras that don't read the Ektachrome 64 correctly, not to gripe, but to know so that remedies can be made available to possibly correct the potential problem.

Two remedies that come to mind for cameras that are misreading the Ektachrome ASA setting are "pulling" the film one stop during processing; the second remedy could be the use of a neutral density filter rated to cut one f-stop when shooting in the bright outdoors (thereby getting the f-stop away from F-16 and closer to the F-11 range, where the aperture setting will probably be more accurate.

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So, lets get that list going as I am clueless as to which Super-8 cameras will read Ektachrome 64 correctly and which cameras will not.

[reedsturtevant]

A list has been growing on the Wiki for a couple months, please feel free to add to it or correct it - or to copy the data to another place if you like

http://super8wiki.com/index.php/Super_8 ... ld_cameras

[ccortez]

"pulling" the film one stop during processing;

Doesn't this effectively double the processing costs, at Dwayne's at least?

Maybe if there are enough requests, they can offer 2 options - regular, or pulled/corrected processing - for the same price, as I assume the added cost reflects the necessity to do one-off or special runs.

[Alex]

Yes, pulling is normally more money, perhaps double the cost of regular processing. My hope and perhaps expectation is that it's in everyones best interest to not penalize someone for owning a camera that suddenly is "wrong" in the way it reads a new film stock.

Does not charging exrtra for pull processing penalize the lab? Perhaps a little bit. However, if the no additional cost pull service is offered one day every week, then the lab might get enough orders in a weeks time to do a run of pull processing at the same price as regular processing.

Can somebody confirm whether or not if enough pull orders are processed at the same time if it actually costs the lab similar to a regular run of Ektachrome?

One scenario could be that regular Ektachrome processing is done M-W and Friday, and Pull processing is done every Thursday at no additional charge, or some variation of that formula.

It will take a bit of cooperation by the super-8 processing labs to accomodate the filmmaker using a camera that does not acknowledge a 64 ASA film stock, but keep in mind Kodak is basically turning over it's processing enterprise to smaller super-8 labs around the world. Hopefully these smaller super-8 labs should be more agile and accomodating than a corporation normally can be.

I'll guess we'll find out.

[jpolzfuss]

Hi!

Remember to take a look at the "Additional Resources"-section at the bottom of the page in the Wiki, too! E.g. the "Here's another list of Super8-cameras and how to get them to work with the new 64T" will lead you to a page that lists less cameras, but is sometimes more detailed (e.g. the Wiki only says "Nizos sound and silent (but not compact series)", while that page separates between Nizo s480, s800, 4056, ... .)

Jörg

[monobath]

Yes, pulling is normally more money, perhaps double the cost of regular processing. My hope and perhaps expectation is that it's in everyones best interest to not penalize someone for owning a camera that suddenly is "wrong" in the way it reads a new film stock.

Does not charging exrtra for pull processing penalize the lab? Perhaps a little bit. However, if the no additional cost pull service is offered one day every week, then the lab might get enough orders in a weeks time to do a run of pull processing at the same price as regular processing.

Can somebody confirm whether or not if enough pull orders are processed at the same time if it actually costs the lab similar to a regular run of Ektachrome?

One scenario could be that regular Ektachrome processing is done M-W and Friday, and Pull processing is done every Thursday at no additional charge, or some variation of that formula.

It will take a bit of cooperation by the super-8 processing labs to accomodate the filmmaker using a camera that does not acknowledge a 64 ASA film stock, but keep in mind Kodak is basically turning over it's processing enterprise to smaller super-8 labs around the world. Hopefully these smaller super-8 labs should be more agile and accomodating than a corporation normally can be.

I'll guess we'll find out.

Push or pull processing is simply a matter of slowing down or speeding up the time in the first developer, while leaving other timings alone. This may be easy or difficult to do depending on the type of processor. But regardless, it's an extra service that is out of the norm, and therefore has some costs for the processor associated with it. It is traditionally a premium-priced service for any type of film at any lab, regardless of the actual cost to the film processor. Only intense competition for push / pull service would likely change that, and that isn't likely.

[Alex]

Kodak is handing over their processing service to smaller labs all over the world (by discontinuing Kodachrome and introducing Ektachrome 64 as a replacement).

That can be viewed as a very generous thing Kodak is doing and a level of generousity that I would hope would be matched by the independent labs that may see a rise in processing because of Kodak's bowing out.

I'm suggesting a once a week scenario where all Ektachrome 64 film can be pulled (because of the hiccup the Ektachrome 64 may cause in some cameras), which should allow for a number of Ektachrome cartridges to all be done at the same time which would hopefully mean no additional cost because of the volume processing being done.

[vonfilm]

I am glad to see on the Wiki that my Nizo 801 will read the new Ektachrome 64. Would this apply to my Nizo 481(non-macro) also?

[Alex]

A list has been growing on the Wiki for a couple months, please feel free to add to it or correct it - or to copy the data to another place if you like

http://super8wiki.com/index.php/Super_8 ... ld_cameras

On the super-8wiki page it says something about some cameras viewing the notch as ASA 40 while other cameras may view the same notch as ASA 160? Is that true?

[jpolzfuss]

viewing the notch as ASA 40 while other cameras may view the same notch as ASA 160?

Most of the cameras will look if the nodge is large enough for 160 ASA. All smaller nodges will be rated as 40 ASA.
But there are a few cameras that'll rate every nodge larger than the 40-ASA-nodge as 160 ASA.
(And there some cameras that can differ between more than just 40 and 160 ASA, but can't handle 64ASA - e.g. some Canons will detect 40, 160 and 200 ASA...)

[clivetobin]

I originally put this up on Usenet, but after being advised that nobody reads the film groups there any more I am putting it here for anyone who might be interested.

This pertains to cameras that have a separate window for the electric eye:

If the ASA 64 film is being read as 40, this would take 0.2ND over the lens. If it is being read as 160, this would instead take 0.4ND over the electric eye window.

If the ASA 100 film is being read as 40, this would take 0.4ND. If it
is being read as 160, this would instead take 0.2ND over the electric
eye window.

For a Kodak XL camera that lacks the daylight filter, I suppose you
could stick a No.85 in front of the lens and stick 0.6ND in front of
the electric eye to shoot the ASA 64 tungsten (40 daylight) film. Plus
you might have to carve out the ASA notch in the cartridge to 160 to
get the camera to physically accept it. I have never actually tried
this. (This assumes you have a Kodak super-8 camera that still works. All of them after the original M-2 and M-4 (and maybe M-6?) of 1965 used some experimental rubbery plastic for the motor gear, which crumbles to powder with time.)

[reedsturtevant]

I am glad to see on the Wiki that my Nizo 801 will read the new Ektachrome 64. Would this apply to my Nizo 481(non-macro) also?

According to this page it seems the Nizo 480 is OK - let us know if the new film works well in your 481, or you can use the notch ruler to examine your camera and report back...

[danpuddick]

the nizo'z - at least the 481 561, 801, pro etc, all read the speed notch of a cartridge with the mechanism shown below.



It can read continuously anywhere up to 160(no filter notch)/250(with filter notch).