16mm question--film magazines

[tfunch24]

Were most of the 16mm cine cameras that were sold as "home movie" cameras magazine-based, i.e. the film was encased in a magazine for easy loading?

The reason I ask is because I'm thinking of buying a used Bell&Howell 16mm cine camera from a woman. The woman's late father owned the camera, and she's never used it. I haven't inspected it yet and I'd thought I'd ask around here before I did. The woman made it clear that the only thing her father used it for was to shoot home movies.

I read here (or on Hostboard) that film magazines are no longer readily available. Yes, no, maybe so?

She seems desperate to get rid of it so maybe I can get a good deal.

Tom

[drsanchez]

Were most of the 16mm cine cameras that were sold as "home movie" cameras magazine-based, i.e. the film was encased in a magazine for easy loading?

The reason I ask is because I'm thinking of buying a used Bell&Howell 16mm cine camera from a woman. The woman's late father owned the camera, and she's never used it. I haven't inspected it yet and I'd thought I'd ask around here before I did. The woman made it clear that the only thing her father used it for was to shoot home movies.

I read here (or on Hostboard) that film magazines are no longer readily available. Yes, no, maybe so?

She seems desperate to get rid of it so maybe I can get a good deal.

Tom

I own one of those 16mm Bell and Howells but I lost the magazine. At Mac Java they sell and reload the magazines (see link)
http://www.athens.net/~macjava/filmpage.html
but what happens when you want to get it processed? Do you send in the whole magazine? Wouldn't that mean you could only get processed the same number as your magazines?

[tfunch24]

Previously on "Happy Days":

but what happens when you want to get it processed? Do you send in the whole magazine? Wouldn't that mean you could only get processed the same number as your magazines?

They probably send you back your empty magazine and your processed film.

With a magazine-based camera, I assume you're limited by the number of magazines that are available to you.

Again, were most B&H models sold to the great unwashed masses magazine-based? I've done some research on the internet and have come up with very little--mainly just online catalogs of antique or rare camera dealers and they do not offer much information.

Tom

[studiocarter]

There were, I think, more 100 foot spool cameras than the 50 foot magazine ones. I shot one and asked for a return of it. Got it and film that had images. It had old Plus X that worked, no sweat. I like those 100 foot load Keystone "Bricks" cause they also have single frame for cartoons.
Michael

[tfunch24]

regular8mm wrote:

There were, I think, more 100 foot spool cameras than the 50 foot magazine ones.

Thank you for clearing that up.

The woman is moving into a house that's smaller than her current home and she's trying to clear out all of the old stuff that's accumulated over the years. As far as I know, she knows next to nothing about cine cameras (she's probably dismissed the B&H as an extinct format) so I'm hoping to get it for a song. I don't know what condition it's in (sounds like a job for an old-time camera shop).

BTW, she's the mother of one of my college classmates. He knows about my filmmaking aspirations and he tipped her off that I might be interested in the camera. So I guess the lesson here is to let people know that you're interested in R8/S8/DS8/9.5/16 filmmaking...it may pay off even if you do get a lot of odd looks and "Why don't you just get a video camera?"

Tom

[David M. Leugers]

Although the 100ft roll cameras were more plentiful, there are thousands of 16mm magazine cameras out there and they usually sell very cheaply on eBay. Shooting the 16mm magazine film was wonderful as long as the magazine was loaded properly. (Kodak did a marvelous job but they do not offer this service anymore). The 50ft magazines have a metal pressure plate and can give pretty steady and sharp images. It is possible to load your own and that is what I do. I have a number of empty magazines that I will load when I get in the mood and film at my leisure. The Bell and Howell line of 16mm 50ft magazine cameras were pretty awesome. The latter grey or green leather models were probably the best ever made. The Kodak Royal was a black leather beauty and gave B+H a run for their money for the top spot. B+H just wins out because they use the standard "C" mount for the lenses while the Kodaks
have their own special mount so only Kodak lenses (although superb) can be used on the Royal. I plan to build my own core loader to break down longer rolls of 16mm film onto the 50ft cores ready for loading into the magazines. I might offer magazine reloading with a persons supplied film if there is any interest. Oh yeah, you send the magazine in to the lab and they return your processed film with your magazine. This is a standard that labs are pretty familiar with. Franklin labs in California is the place to go for 16mm B+W magazine development. Frank is very familiar with the magazines. Good luck.

[wahiba]

The Bell and Howell 16 mm cartridge cameras are nice pieces of kit in their own right, so worth having just to admire. It might even have a TTH lense.

I have been reliably informed on this forum that the cartidges can be reloaded, but it ain't easy. I have a diagram from a book, and it is posted on my web site, showing the path, and boy, it is complicated. Anyhow I have tried it with some dud film. Each time it runs a bit, and then jams. I cannot yet work out whether it is my loading, a fault in the cartridge, or the camera is not up to it. I have left it for the time being.

An attraction for the DIY enthusiast is that the 50 feet of film they take could nicely be developed in a Russian developing tank.

As for 16 mm home movies. The Grandaddy is the Kodak 16, which takes a 100 feet roll. It even has a box camera type viewfinder. The one I have has had an extension from the shutter drive added. I think someone must have been trying out sound synch with a tape recorder. It only has one sped though, 16 fps.

I ran a film through it years ago and it worked fine. There were plenty made so can often be found without spending a fortune. The hard bit is finding a projector that will run at 16 fps. Most modern ones are 24 fps for sound, with two blades. I acquired and old B&H sound projector that has the three blade shutter. The amplifier is dud but it works fine at 16 fps silently. Well it did, I have not tried it out fr years.

For old hand cranked mini projectors 9.5mm had a much better selection. It is a pity they did no know their number was up when Kodak introduced 8mm and made 8mm versions of their little projectors. Consequently, at least in Europe, 8 mm remained a middle class affair as acquiring the whole kit was probably on a par of buying a digital camcorder and LCD projector.

[tfunch24]

Thank you all for your helpful responses.

I double-posted this thread here and on Hostboard. It's almost amusing to see the difference between the kind of replies I get here and there.

I'll finally get a chance to see this camera on Saturday.

Tom

[studiocarter]

I also have a paper showing how to load the things and have done it. It worked, using dud film. It took some time. Wasn't that bad. Could get good at it if I wanted to. Martin wrote about it. Just lost interest after solving the problem.
The cameras are very nice and compact with many cool lenses. I like all the chrome and leather. I have two 16mm ones and many R8 ones. Now, THEY are the difficult ones to load, the R8 carts.
Best let Martin do them.
Anyone ever shoot Regular 8mm magazines?

[tfunch24]

I never shot D8mm magazines. But I do have this:



I picked it up for $1 in a thrift store. It's in the original box, process date listed as May 1969. My Keystone does not accept mags so I'm not sure what I'm going to do with it. Only two labs in the U.S. develop Kodachrome II and I don't think it would be worth it to shoot it.

Tom

[tfunch24]

Anyone ever used a Bell & Howell Filmo 141B 16mm cine camera? I've tried searching for it on the internet and all I get are sites selling manuals for the camera.

Tom