editing super 8
Moderator: Andreas Wideroe
editing super 8
what kind of a machine do i need to edit my super 8 films? where do i get one? how much should it cost? will i be able to figure out what i am doing without destroying my precious films? I really dont care about getting it transfered to minidv to edit anymore cause i dont care enough to pay for it. if i can edit it first and i like it, then maybe i'll have it transfered when its done, but for now i need help. thanks a lot
before i had a computer, i edited super-8 in-camera. It worked surprisingly well! It also made my silly attempts at movies a lot funnier because the bloopers were not edited out.
However, you can still buy splicing tape from Hama in a good photography store and splicers can be found on Ebay, i imagine. Seems like a big hassle though... i really regret the one time i decided to edit a super-8 movie that way. You should try to keep your precious reversal print safe from harm.
But surely you have a pc, Or did you post this message with telepathic powers? Find a telecine lab that transfers directly to DVD-Rom. They're giving away DVD-Rom drives with Cereal boxes these days and getting some editing software is no problem...
what are your computer specs?
However, you can still buy splicing tape from Hama in a good photography store and splicers can be found on Ebay, i imagine. Seems like a big hassle though... i really regret the one time i decided to edit a super-8 movie that way. You should try to keep your precious reversal print safe from harm.
But surely you have a pc, Or did you post this message with telepathic powers? Find a telecine lab that transfers directly to DVD-Rom. They're giving away DVD-Rom drives with Cereal boxes these days and getting some editing software is no problem...
what are your computer specs?
Well then at least edit digitally first, so you're certain about the cuts you're going to make.
Why don't you make a copy of your original film just in case? I've had one made a while ago and it only cost very little. This company did it: http://www.super8.nl
If you're really worried about projection, do a blow-up to a format people will project and edit digitally to print an EDL list, which a lab can use to make an edited version of your film exactly the way you edited on the pc. Don't forget that a home-spliced movie is very easily broken. Best is use of glue, unless you're using single-8 instead of super-8.
Well, good luck!
Why don't you make a copy of your original film just in case? I've had one made a while ago and it only cost very little. This company did it: http://www.super8.nl
If you're really worried about projection, do a blow-up to a format people will project and edit digitally to print an EDL list, which a lab can use to make an edited version of your film exactly the way you edited on the pc. Don't forget that a home-spliced movie is very easily broken. Best is use of glue, unless you're using single-8 instead of super-8.
Well, good luck!
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theshortspan
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Do most labs do this? Does it go directly to DVD or is it via beta first.Jan wrote: Find a telecine lab that transfers directly to DVD-Rom.
http://www.theshortspan.com
Bouldering in Ireland
Bouldering in Ireland
If you want to edit the old fashioned way you need a device called an editor, which consists of a small (6 inch or so) screen lit by a 10W bulb and a gate...plus two arms for the film reels. Some are electrically driven but usually in super 8 you hand wind the reels.
Then you need a splicer and some splices...some people swear by tape splices (adhesive tape) others swear by cement splices (glue).
The only problem is that you literally cut and splice the film. While it is theoretically possible to undo a splice, it is difficult and the film would likely not be perfectly restored to it's pre-edit condition.
You have to be fairly certain of what you are doing. You could do a DIY telecine to hard drive or even VHS, and edit electronically until you are sure of the final cut...then go and physically cut the film.
Then you need a splicer and some splices...some people swear by tape splices (adhesive tape) others swear by cement splices (glue).
The only problem is that you literally cut and splice the film. While it is theoretically possible to undo a splice, it is difficult and the film would likely not be perfectly restored to it's pre-edit condition.
You have to be fairly certain of what you are doing. You could do a DIY telecine to hard drive or even VHS, and edit electronically until you are sure of the final cut...then go and physically cut the film.
The traditional route to editing is to view the film with an editor/viewer. Then decide in what order you want the material you have: shoot any titles you need. Then, using the editor again, mark (most editors have a maker that makes a small hole in the film where you want to cut it).
Next, you start cutting the film into scenes, then sticking them back together in the order you want.
A big decision is whether to use tape or cement splices. Both are good for many years. Tape splices are probably better for pulling bits of fluff from projector gates! BUT, if you plan to add a sound stripe, you MUST use cement splices, preferably using a bevel splicer that makes a joint that is almost the same thickness as the film.
In many ways, editing is both as creative and as time consuming as shooting. Enjoy.
Next, you start cutting the film into scenes, then sticking them back together in the order you want.
A big decision is whether to use tape or cement splices. Both are good for many years. Tape splices are probably better for pulling bits of fluff from projector gates! BUT, if you plan to add a sound stripe, you MUST use cement splices, preferably using a bevel splicer that makes a joint that is almost the same thickness as the film.
In many ways, editing is both as creative and as time consuming as shooting. Enjoy.
Any ideas on a good source for cheap editors? 7dayshop.com in the UK sell the Hama splicer for about 7 pounds, and all the associated tapes. I've got one, and it's a nice little device. So far, however, I've only used it for putting leaders and trailers on my films, and haven't got as far as editing.
Lee
Lee
I'll second the idea to edit a video copy first before cutting the actual film.
Maybe it's because all of my viewers are cheap pieces of crap, but I've personally never used one. I just use a projector and a sheet of paper to locate roughly where the cut should be, then a magnifying glass to find the exact frame.
I have a Ciro guillotine splicer and I absolutely adore it. It uses unsprocketed roll tape that it cuts and punches to fit the film. The splice takes just two frames and ends on the frameline so it's not at all visible when projecting, and it doesn't cover the main sound stripe, so you can use it with sound film or film you intend to have stripped (unless you're also recording on the balance stripe).
These splicers come up every now and then on eBay. Sometimes they sell for exuberant amounts of money, but mostly they're quite reasonable. The metal version goes for more than the plastic one.
Maybe it's because all of my viewers are cheap pieces of crap, but I've personally never used one. I just use a projector and a sheet of paper to locate roughly where the cut should be, then a magnifying glass to find the exact frame.
I have a Ciro guillotine splicer and I absolutely adore it. It uses unsprocketed roll tape that it cuts and punches to fit the film. The splice takes just two frames and ends on the frameline so it's not at all visible when projecting, and it doesn't cover the main sound stripe, so you can use it with sound film or film you intend to have stripped (unless you're also recording on the balance stripe).
These splicers come up every now and then on eBay. Sometimes they sell for exuberant amounts of money, but mostly they're quite reasonable. The metal version goes for more than the plastic one.
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fritzcarraldo
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Well, at first you'll only need your hands.
My first 4 short super8mm films were edited with a normal transparent tape and scissors, i used a lamp, a nomral one and a magnifiing glass, a simple one, but many times you wouldn't even use that i simply edited with my bare eyes.
The great secret is to shoot the film trying to edit it during the shooting, so that later you don't have to edit much.
Of course it's better to edit with an editor, i have a simple plastic one from AGFA and i use HAMA tape i buy from Germany, with Daniel Wittner.
I don't use those viewers/editors, i don't need them.
But i repeat, with hands scissors and simple tape it's possible to edit with excellent results, i have films edited 4 years ago, projected more than 30 times and still great, never broke, of course they have some scratches, but they are o.k.
My first 4 short super8mm films were edited with a normal transparent tape and scissors, i used a lamp, a nomral one and a magnifiing glass, a simple one, but many times you wouldn't even use that i simply edited with my bare eyes.
The great secret is to shoot the film trying to edit it during the shooting, so that later you don't have to edit much.
Of course it's better to edit with an editor, i have a simple plastic one from AGFA and i use HAMA tape i buy from Germany, with Daniel Wittner.
I don't use those viewers/editors, i don't need them.
But i repeat, with hands scissors and simple tape it's possible to edit with excellent results, i have films edited 4 years ago, projected more than 30 times and still great, never broke, of course they have some scratches, but they are o.k.
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CHAS
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How do you make splices with ordinary tape? How do you deal with the sprocket hole issue? How do you make sure the two pieces of film are held down and level?fritzcarraldo wrote: But i repeat, with hands scissors and simple tape it's possible to edit with excellent results, i have films edited 4 years ago, projected more than 30 times and still great, never broke, of course they have some scratches, but they are o.k.
It's crude and it's not for permanent splices, but works for emergency repairs.CHAS wrote: How do you make splices with ordinary tape? How do you deal with the sprocket hole issue? How do you make sure the two pieces of film are held down and level?
Hold the two pieces of film together overlapping and making sure the sprockets are aligned. Then cut both at the same time with the scissors on the frame line (half way between the sprockets). Then stick a piece of tape on the end of one film, put the other film against it on the tape. Wrap the tape around and trim the excess tape. Don't worry about the sprocket holes - the projector will punch the holes through the tape.
The Ciro Guillotine splicer is definitely the best and easiest to use tape splicer. And it doesn't cover the sound stripe area so the film can still be striped.
Try editing on film. It's a great part of the experience. I teach a filmmaking workshop and most of my students edit on film. Some people are afraid to make the first cuts but once they get started they love it. I like to do as much as possible without a computer. People do so much stuff on computers it's a refreshing experience to do something the manual way.
Editing in-camera is a great, great way to learn moviemaking.
The fact that filmschools now seem to work exclusively in miniDV (at least the one i went to) is perhaps not as good as they think it is. I shot my first super-8 movie completely with in-camera editing (actors started acting and then i started filming, and i stopped filming before the actors stopped acting) and it was just such a kick to get that kodachrome film back from the lab. It was a ready to watch movie!
The fact that filmschools now seem to work exclusively in miniDV (at least the one i went to) is perhaps not as good as they think it is. I shot my first super-8 movie completely with in-camera editing (actors started acting and then i started filming, and i stopped filming before the actors stopped acting) and it was just such a kick to get that kodachrome film back from the lab. It was a ready to watch movie!