New Danish Super 8 camera to debut in 2014

[verydarkroom]

Indeed. If everything in this world is crunched according to the numbers, it would be a sad, dreary, boring world indeed. Here's to love, passion, and the dreamers. Two thumbs up for Tommy and Lasse.

[kontrabass888]

As a film user, I will support this new design of super 8 camera anyway. I am so happy to see that there are still young people are interesting to developing film equipment.
However, I don't think this camera will be succeed in the market, and it is also not a very practical tool.
Because,
1) The small format camera must be compact and easy to carry. otherwise no point to use it.
2) This camera shares C mount, but there are not so many choice for C mount lenses which are designed for super8. only beaulieu lenses.

My suggestion

I would like to have a super 8 camera

1)Film magazine for 100' spool
2)Non reflex D mount, same flange focal distance as Bolex h8, so it can use D mount lens and C mount lens with adapter.
3)Price under 500EUR.

[bolextech]

Excellent report on the camera by Friedemann Wachsmuth (in German):

http://www.filmkorn....-aus-daenemark/

Jean-Louis

[kontrabass888]

Excellent report on the camera by Friedemann Wachsmuth (in German):

http://www.filmkorn....-aus-daenemark/

Jean-Louis

link not working

[bolextech]

Then just go to

http://www.filmkorn.org/

JL

[kontrabass888]

Well, I think a non reflex Bolex H8 with electric motor and a reflex zoom lens will do the same job as this new camera.
(Som berthiot pan cinor d-mount or Angenieux c mount )
It just need screw off the eye piece tube and attach the LCD screen onto the view finder of the lens.

[kuparikettu]

Well, I think a non reflex Bolex H8 with electric motor and a reflex zoom lens will do the same job as this new camera.
(Som berthiot pan cinor d-mount or Angenieux c mount )
It just need screw off the eye piece tube and attach the LCD screen onto the view finder of the lens.

Except it doesn't take super-8 film, s-8 cartridges nor does it have sync sound recording, wlan operating... or parts manufactured 2013! ;)

[kontrabass888]

Except it doesn't take super-8 film, s-8 cartridges nor does it have sync sound recording, wlan operating... or parts manufactured 2013! ;)

1) Beaulieu does all those applications. and this small producing group can never make a cam better than beaulieu.
2) How many professional movie maker or TV producer will use super 8mm today?

I believe that the reason why super 8 is still alive today, it is because there are certain numbers of hobbyists and students are still interesting to play with small gauge film

Today's technology could afford us to make super modern- professional- fancy...super 8 cam, but the question is how many will you produce and how many you could sell?

Super 8 is not originally made for professionals. and now, when professionals went to digital, a new super 8 cam should target to amateur and student market.

[MovieStuff]

Except it doesn't take super-8 film, s-8 cartridges nor does it have sync sound recording, wlan operating... or parts manufactured 2013! ;)

1) Beaulieu does all those applications. and this small producing group can never make a cam better than beaulieu.

But the Beaulieu still uses the problematic super 8 cart in its original orientation, which yields wildly unpredictable results, in terms of stability. If I had to spend a fair sum on the Beaulieu or the new camera in question, all things being equal regarding lens quality, sound capability, silent operation, etc, I would rather buy the new camera because it would have the added advantage of guaranteed registration. Obviously, it would cost more than a used Beaulieu and no one wants to spend more money than necessary. But not getting what you need at half the price is no bargain and, considering how expensive super 8 film is to buy and process, the new camera would be a much better investment. I mean, anyone that's buying either camera is obviously serious about shooting and would, therefore, be purchasing a large amount of film in the future. I would think the savings realized from having more usable footage per batch of film compared to the crap shoot of using the Beaulieu would eventually equal the difference is price.

2) How many professional movie maker or TV producer will use super 8mm today?

You don't have to be a professional to want professional results. More to the point about cost of operation, remember, it isn't just the loss of footage that is at risk when shooting with a Beaulieu or any other regular super 8 camera, it is the cost of production and other people's time that's involved with the production. The new camera may cost more but the VALUE is better because you are not gambling as much with other resources.

Today's technology could afford us to make super modern- professional- fancy...super 8 cam, but the question is how many will you produce and how many you could sell?

The same could be said about scanners but we've take over 250 orders for our new Retro-8 scanner and half those orders are from individuals that could save money by sending their film out to one of the thousands of transfer houses that exist. Some people just want the pleasure of an expensive hobby and have the money to pursue it, even if others don't understand the appeal or the financial sense of it.

Super 8 is not originally made for professionals. and now, when professionals went to digital, a new super 8 cam should target to amateur and student market

Why? Because students have so much more money to spend? The new camera will find its own market and I can guarantee that students will be the last to embrace it. But any professional that wants the "classic super 8" look for their project would much prefer to have the look of super 8 from the 70's when its registration and dependability was good rather than the look of super 8 from the 90's when the registration was notoriously undependable and jumpy.

Roger

[Tscan]

Roger- would it be an easy task for the Retro8 to view the full Max 8 frame from a camera like this? I don't see the pillar boxes being an issue, but would it require any camera adjustment?

[dsl15746]

Hi "Kontrabass"

Let me provide a few inputs to your post

As a film user, I will support this new design of super 8 camera anyway. I am so happy to see that there are still young people are interesting to developing film equipment.
However, I don't think this camera will be succeed in the market, and it is also not a very practical tool.
Because,
1) The small format camera must be compact and easy to carry. otherwise no point to use it.
2) This camera shares C mount, but there are not so many choice for C mount lenses which are designed for super8. only beaulieu lenses.

1) I think our camera is already compact and easy to carry especially after we added the side monitor allowing "point and shoot" without all the "extra junk" attached - see below (you could even unscrew the WIFI antenna if you wanted)

Logmar 002 - 1080w.jpg

2) There's plenty of C Mount lenses available on the market today so this is not quite true - we have used a broad variety already.

My suggestion

I would like to have a super 8 camera
1)Film magazine for 100' spool
2)Non reflex D mount, same flange focal distance as Bolex h8, so it can use D mount lens and C mount lens with adapter.
3)Price under 500EUR.

1) It's a nice idea to have larger spools - we've also considered this but opted out as we thourght it was too difficult for people to get their hands on compared to the standard cartridge.
2) Our shutter mechanism requires a C mount - there's simply not enough space between the film and lens to accompany other mounts.
3) It's impossible to manufacture anything of this nature for 500 EUR in the volume we can expect this market to bring - the minimum wage in Denmark is currently 21$ USD (15,7EUR) per hour, VAT is 25% and income taxes are 48% so in order to make anything for 500 EUR one would have to:

A) manufacture outside the european union which would mean it's difficult to control the quality (since you need to travel and over see it)
B) Use the worst "condom grade" plastics available
C) Not have any features at all except cartridge and motor.

Best regards
Lasse

[kontrabass888]

Hi "Kontrabass"

Let me provide a few inputs to your post

As a film user, I will support this new design of super 8 camera anyway. I am so happy to see that there are still young people are interesting to developing film equipment.
However, I don't think this camera will be succeed in the market, and it is also not a very practical tool.
Because,
1) The small format camera must be compact and easy to carry. otherwise no point to use it.
2) This camera shares C mount, but there are not so many choice for C mount lenses which are designed for super8. only beaulieu lenses.

1) I think our camera is already compact and easy to carry especially after we added the side monitor allowing "point and shoot" without all the "extra junk" attached - see below (you could even unscrew the WIFI antenna if you wanted)

Logmar 002 - 1080w.jpg

2) There's plenty of C Mount lenses available on the market today so this is not quite true - we have used a broad variety already.

My suggestion

I would like to have a super 8 camera
1)Film magazine for 100' spool
2)Non reflex D mount, same flange focal distance as Bolex h8, so it can use D mount lens and C mount lens with adapter.
3)Price under 500EUR.

1) It's a nice idea to have larger spools - we've also considered this but opted out as we thourght it was too difficult for people to get their hands on compared to the standard cartridge.
2) Our shutter mechanism requires a C mount - there's simply not enough space between the film and lens to accompany other mounts.
3) It's impossible to manufacture anything of this nature for 500 EUR in the volume we can expect this market to bring - the minimum wage in Denmark is currently 21$ USD (15,7EUR) per hour, VAT is 25% and income taxes are 48% so in order to make anything for 500 EUR one would have to:

A) manufacture outside the european union which would mean it's difficult to control the quality (since you need to travel and over see it)
B) Use the worst "condom grade" plastics available
C) Not have any features at all except cartridge and motor.

Best regards
Lasse

I have an idea can make it become more compact and be able to use 30m magazine.

[carllooper]

Hi Carl,

I'd be keen to know if there could be an SDK made available for the camera, ie. for writing up third party software for the camera. Being both a filmmaker and a software developer (amongst other things) I can imagine all sorts of useful data overlays I'd love to write up for the digital display.

C

You'll be pleased to know that our WIFI protocol is completely open source so people can write their own apps for iPhone, Android, Windows Phone etc. and do the following commands:

The following features can be controlled via WIFI today:
â–  Start and stop recording
â–  Record X amont of frames then automatically stop
â–  Record X amount of seconds then automatically stop
â–  Shutter parking (creates blank frame on film for easy identification of new session)
â–  Shutter loading (special state for inserting new film)
â–  Recording gain adjustment (audio)
â–  Monitor volume adjustment (audio)
â–  Camera turn off

And these features will become available via future firmware upgrades:
â–  Time lapse with the following features
â–  Programmable starting time in seconds
â–  Pogrammable exposure time
â–  Programmable end of recording time
â–  Record X amount of seconds then automatically stop
â–  Record X amount of frames then automatically stop

Here's how it works and what you as an app developer has to do:

Your device has to connect to the camera hotspot dubbed "Logmar S8-xxxx" where xxxx is the last 4 digits of the camera production serial number, the camera will provide you with an IP address and from there you must open a TCP/IP socket towards the camera's IP which always is 1.2.3.4 at port 2000 then the camera will respond to you using ASCII commands.

For example you can send command (in ASCII): %FPS=29970%\r\n
that will set the frame rate to 29.970fps (NTSC rate) the frame rate command is send as a whole number but internally divided by 1000 by the camera to avoid floating point calculations.
If you send %RECORD%\r\n the camera starts recording at the previously set frame rate - while recording the camera periodically sends out the current frame number with command %FCNT=0004%\r\n - that way you can calculate the remaning or elapsed frame count, time left or feet.

Best regards
Lasse

Thanks Lasse. That's really great. But I was thinking a bit more of a lower level access - at the firmware level, ie. something like a C++ interface - where you can see the firmware source code itself - or at least a public interface into such, ie. where you can hook into lower level operations otherwise taking place. For example, if one wanted to write support for a different audio codec. Or to process the viewfinder sensor output in different ways (for different video feedback). Or to implement a different wi-fi data stream protocol.

A kind of low level plugin layer around the firmware.

Of course I may be the only one ever needing (or desiring) anything like that. On the other hand it could allow others (such as me) to do some of the firmware upgrade work that you yourself would otherwise have to do. You can create a small ecology around the software. Expose the low level operations and leave it to others to build higher level functionality (in addition to your own).

C

[aj]

I have an idea can make it become more compact and be able to use 30m magazine.

All very nice if you don't have to contstruct it yourself.
Just get a Beaulieu 6/7/9008 with a SD-8 or a any super-8 camera with a topdoor for a 200ft Kodak magazine.

There are no Super-8 30 meter magazines.
There is very little supply of meterware and very few can roll their own from these.

[Tracy G Williams]

I will certainly be buying one - it ticks all the boxes as far as I'm concerned. It's worth the projected price just for the crystal sync, video assist and film registration. HDMI video out would be useful, then I could use my PIX240 for multitrack sound with a video guide and use the camera's internal sound recorder to record the timecode. But then it would also be useful if it wasn't almost dark and raining today!

I completely applaud this initiative, wish it every success and look forward to my delivery next year