Kodak Vision3 50D in Nizo Professional. Notching?

[Andreas Wideroe]

Hi everyone.

I was out filming some Super8 this weekend with my Nizo Professional and Kodak Vision3 50D. I didn't have a lightmeter with me so I couldn't check if my Nizo exposed the film correctly, but the the lightmter in the viewfinder showed between 8 and 11 most of the time. We'll see how it turns out.

Anyways, anyone know how the notching is on these carts and how it will work in a Nizo Professional with 85 filter disabled?

Cheers,
Andreas

[mortron]

Hey Adnreas,

I wanted to comment because I started a thread about the V50D and why it has the notch size it does.
I haven't used the Kodak 50D yet but according the the internet the notch size the same as the Velvia 50D
and I assume that like the Velvia it doesn't have a filter notch either. So assuming I am correct,
I think that the film will be rated at 25 ASA when when inserted into any automatic camera with the
filter pin, so that would mean the Nizo Pro.

This notch size makes sense for negative film than for the 50D reversal because Kodak generally suggest
overexposure. So although it will be 25ASA this is what Kodak want, so it should have been exposed "correct"

Cheers,
Josh

[Andreas Wideroe]

Thanks Josh!

Well, let's wait and see. Hopefully the images will turn out nice.

[Will2]

Interesting. Last time I shot Velvia from Spectra a thought it was under exposed in general.

Over slight exposure won't be a problem on the 50D. It really is Kodak's best looking negative stock and should be perfect for Super 8.

[Andersens Tears]

Hey Adnreas,


I haven't used the Kodak 50D yet but according the the internet the notch size the same as the Velvia 50D
Cheers,
Josh

Hi Josh, this is not correct - the Vision3 50D appears to be notched as 40D/64T as I have just compared a roll of Vision3 50D with a roll of Wittner Velvia 50D and the ASA notch is longer on the Vision3 50D.

So it should be exposed as 40D.

However I have to conceed that the Velvia 50D is notched as 25D and will be read as such on many cameras - which is odd as none of the footage I have ever shot has looked 1 full f-stop overexposed - which is the difference between 25 and 50.

This is also strange as reversal film is not supposed to have such a good lattitude - maybe this is peculiar to Fuji Velvia 50D - if you had overexposed K40, 64T or 100D by one full [f-stop - you would most certainly notice it.

The only 50D I have shot to hand to look at was shot with a Minolta XL Sound 84 and a Bauer s609xl Microprocessor - which are both 40/160 cameras and the exposures look fine.

Wittner have a history of odd ASA notching - their Wittnerchrome 100D was notched as 64D/100T.

Cheers,

Jamie

[mortron]

Hey again Andreas,

Sorry for the mis-info. What I read was actually talking about pro8's 50D. Apparently theirs is notched
the same as 40 / 25 ASA. Thanks Jamie to you Jamie for the clarification.

The Nizo Pro reads everything up 160 / 100 ASA I believe so your camera should have read it as 40 if
it is notched as 64 / 40 ASA. Should be fine in this case and will still be a little overexposed as Kodak
suggest.

Will, it is strange that your results came out underexposed. What camera did you shoot on?

Cheers,
Josh

[Maurizio Di Cintio]

Hello Andreas,

The Nizo Professional is equipped with a slide system to detect the largeness of the ASA notch; it's got no pins and if you think of it, it's better: the slide triggers a miniscule potentiometer inside the camera which results in sort of a permanent fine trimming of the auto-exposure system.

You should have no problems at all with your footage as long as the cartridge was properly notched.

In any case, with the F stops you mentioned, if anything went wrong, the film should turn out underexposed rather than the other way round.

My toppence.

[Tscan]

I just shot my first roll of V3 50D in my Nizo 481 the other day, and i believe the Professional has the same nothcing system. That would be 40/25 and 160/100. So the 50D would fall into the 40/25ASA reading and from there it depends on how you have your filter switch set. Even though the internal filter is disabled, you will still see the meter jumping between 2/3rd stop if you toggle the filter switch. I can't remember which filter switch setting i actually used, I just chose the one that was giving me the higher f-stop... or 40ASA.

Andreas, If your using an external meter with your Nizo, how much do you compensate for the beam splitter?

[mortron]

Like Maurizio said the Professional has a slide instead of pins so it rates all speeds between the fastest and the slowest.
For the Pro like the 481 this is everything between 16/10 ASA and 160/100 ASA. So it would be read correctly if the
cartridge was notched like Jamie suggests it is.

You are right about the filter switch affecting the speed though even if a daylight cartridge is in the camera - I just
checked and it does indeed change. I did not think cameras generally did this.

So if the Kodak 50D cartridge has a 64T / 40D ASA notch, will the camera read the film as 40 when set to bulb and 25
when set to sun - or will the camera rate it at 64 when set to bulb and 40 when set to sun?

I'm guessing the first one.

[Maurizio Di Cintio]

This Nizo will rate it at 64 when set to bulb. But the Professional has one more most desirable feature, i.e. the automatic filter override which defeats the 85 B automatically when a cartridge containing daylight film stock is inserted: in fact in this case there is no lower notch on the cartridge: a specific pin will sense its absence and swing out the built-in filter and, if I'm not mistaken, in this case the camera should retain a speed setting for the lower film sensitivity. But I may be wrong on this last info...

Either way you might be off about 1 stop maximum on both sides (under-over exposure), which is still perfectly acceptable for negative...

[S8 Booster]

or you could verify it this way:

if you have a K40, Agfa 40, E64T, a Velvia 50 or a KACCEMA cartridge (50) you have a reference cartridge to compare to the 50D.
check the notch size and filter notch for reference.
take cam readings vs a bright surface which gives you a safe reading.
the KACCEMA is basically notched 50D with no daylight filter. K40 cart with cam in bulb setting should read the same as the 50D.

you may also compare the film speed notch size between all of them or get even more confused by paceman´s notch ruler but it is downloadable and can help you to decide the cart notch size: http://www.peaceman.de/blog/index.php/s ... d-improved.


iirc - but this is long ago but i am pretty sure i observed it right on my 1014 xls - this was with a 200T cart which the cam sets to 160 at "T".
now, what i did was to move the daylight filter in and out while observing the exposure meter. now, the f stop reading was identical at both settings so it is up to the sensitivity of the film material to do the job. in this case it responds to 160 with no daylight filter and 100 with the 85 filter engaged.

if you take your cam and point it to a bright surface with the cart door open you may manually disengage the D filter tab in the cart compartment while taking an exposure reading in the cam. do this with and without the filter lever engaged (the outside knob) to either setting. this may reveal the nature of you Nizo (maybe

shoot....

[S8 Booster]

may also be of interest:




shoot....

[Tscan]

After comparing with that notch chart, with vague accuracy, i think the 50D may be notched at 64ASA? in that case my filter switch setting had me under exposing by 1/3rd. I have another roll to shoot, along with some 200T and 500T. Just got my Retro 8 scanner and plan to post a sample clip in the near future with all three V3 stocks, in all their ideal situations.

[S8 Booster]

duelling the other post on 50D:

an old friend form the past. This 50D from pro8mm is notched 64T minus filtenotch = 40D.
compare to the K40,



shoot..... el_film-O

[S8 Booster]

and then there is this one. note that the notch size is measured:
"The X dimension is from the CENTER of the locating slot to the BOTTOM of the film-speed slot."



oh-shotto-el_filmo