Power usage when a super 8 camera is turned on?

[Patrick]

I am planning to do a time lapse shoot of construction over four or five weeks with a Canon 1014 AE (shooting about 12 frames a day.) To avoid unnecessary jolting, I am thinking about leaving the camera turned on continuously. The single frames will be exposed manually with a connected remote control switch that I also use with my Canon EOS 35mm SLR. However, I am curious as to whether a super 8 camera is actually using up any power (when turned on) inbetween frames? Obviously, video cameras and digital still cameras are extremely power hungry - when they are turned on, they are consuming a lot of battery power - even when their users are not specifically doing anything with them.

To add to this, I am considering leaving the Canon on auto exposure mode. At first, I was going to use manual exposure (my preference) and take readings using the EOS still camera. However, there may be occasions where I will not be there all the time. So I will have to leave it up to some of the folks working there to expose the frames for me at regular intervals. I just hope that they don't forget! A lot of these people are not all that knowledgeable about photography so I think it would be a bit too much to expect them to take light readings with an SLR and adjust the f stop on the super 8 camera. Leaving the camera on auto would be the simplest, no fuss solution - all they would have to do is click the remote release every half hour. Still, it is a huge favour that I am asking, I know.

However, does leaving the Canon on auto exposure use up any more power than if it was in manual exposure mode? I am guessing that battery power is utilised when the camera's trigger is partially or fully depressed? Though that presents me with a dilemma. To do single frame shooting, the camera must be in running lock mode and do that, the trigger is fully depressed. I guess my other question is - would a fresh set of AA batteries last for four or five weeks when the camera is running in this mode?

[carllooper]

The only energy used will be for the light meter. Nothing else, but how much I don't know. Will it last for four weeks? I don't know.

According to my Canon 514 manual (which I imagine will be the same sort of warning for the 1014) it says about the main switch (with an underline):

The meter always uses current at any position other than "OFF", so be sure to set it to "OFF" when the camera is not in use in order to avoid wasting the batteries.

Doesn't suggest much in the way of useful information other than to worry.

Now I assume your camera won't be near a power point. But if it is than you can wire up the battery compartment to an appropriate AC to DC convertor (or if the camera has a DC in then use that).

Otherwise using an external battery holder power supply would be good idea. If nothing else it would be easier for someone to replace the batteries in it (if required) without affecting the camera positioning.

You could test a brand new set of batteries for as long as there is time available before the 4/5 week shoot - checking the battery level each day. For example, lets suppose you have a week before the shoot, then you could test the batteries for a week and if they last the week then schedule a battery change for each week of the shoot. If they last less than a week, then schedule the battery change accordingly.

The only cost is batteries. I picked up a pack of 20 AAs from the post office (of all places) for 8.95.

Now depending on the model, the 1014 may or may not have a DC power input, but you can otherwise easily just run a generous amount of wires out from the battery compartment to an external battery holder sitting on the ground a safe distance from upsetting the camera. Cheap plastic battery holders, wire and crocodile clips can be picked up from Jaycar.

Carl

[Patrick]

quote="carllooper"]The only energy used will be for the light meter. [/quote]

Yea, that's what I suspected. Would be a non-issue if I was doing it manual and using a seperate meter as originally planned.

I assume your camera won't be near a power point.

Not exactly. It'll be out on a rural property. There might be a generator on site but as far as I know, the Canon doesn't use AC power.

Using an external battery pack power supply would be good idea. If nothing else it would be easier for someone to replace the batteries in it (if required) without affecting the camera positioning.

Unfortunately, I wouldn't know the first thing about building a battery pack. On the Canon 1014, there are two sections where batteries are placed - in the hand grip and also the side of the main body. When mounted to a tripod, the hand grip would be in a horizontal position - so very tricky to remove the batteries from there without gravity being on your side. Removing the batteries from the side would be more straight forward but you do have to use a little bit of force to remove and replace the side cover - and that just might jolt the camera. Though I can't recall which set of batteries control the light meter and which control the motor.

[carllooper]

I added some more info to my post which might be helpful - but otherwise I'll post a more detailed description of what you'll need if you want to try it.

Otherwise I can put a battery back together for you. Not much work. Where in Australia are you? I'm in Melbourne.

Which 1014 model do you have? Probably the original one from what you're saying. I've got one here with a side compartment for batteries. I'll look it up in the repair manual but I believe the side compartment is just for the light meter.

EDIT
Nothing in the repair manual. On second thought the side compartment is probably just additional real estate on the camera body for the full number of batteries the cam as a whole requires (rather than just for light meter).

Carl

[Patrick]

Otherwise I can put a battery back together for you. Not much work. Where in Australia are you? I'm in Melbourne.

Oh cool! Thanks heaps...much apprecicated. I'm currently based on Kangaroo Island in South Australia. Yea, some products are a little limited over here. Silly question but how exactly do you connect the battery pack to the battery chamber? I know there would be some kind of cable or something that runs to the battery chamber - and somehow it joins on to something inside!

[carllooper]

External Battery Holder

What you'll need can be obtained from Jaycar

Two battery holders:

2 AA holder ($0.95)
4 AA holder ($1.65)

The battery holders can be loaded (of course) with AA batterys. The holders have two wires coming out of them. A red wire and a black wire. Now lets look at wiring up the 2 AA holder to the side compartment of the 1014.

With the side compartment facing you, remove the door.
Remove the batterys.
Now you'll see diagrams on the back of the battery compartment showing you how you would normally insert batterys.
In the top compartment the battery diagram has minus (-) to the left and plus (+) to the right.
In the bottom compartment the battery diagram is the opposite way.


Anyway, using some hookup wire (from Jaycar), what you want to do is connect your battery holder red wire to the spring on top right (+)
And connect your battery holder black wire to the spring on the bottom right (-)
Use small crocodile clips to ensure a secure connection between wire and springs

Simple as that. Be sure to connect the correct wires. One false move and the camera will detonate (just kidding).

Now we need to do the same for the handle compartment, but this is more difficult because the springs to which you need to connect the wires are at the other end of the handle ie. deep inside.

If you are willing to dismantle your camera handle you can make it a lot easier to access the springs. You need to peel back the (glued) rubber around the handle (gently or it will tear). And then undo the three screws holding the handle together. Don't worry - can all be put together just as easily - but rubber will need reapplication of adhesive.

Anyway the same deal regarding wires. Attach the red wire to the spring adjacent to the plus sign (+) and the black wire to the spring adjacent the minus sign (-). The diagram, in this case is on the outside of the handle, and in particular that half of the handle you remove. So be sure to use that diagram to identify the plus (+) spring, and the minus (-) spring.

That's all there is to it. You can get hookup wire for a dollar or two. And small crocodile clips to ensure the wires are securely attached to the springs.

Carl

ps. Send me a PM with a postal address and I'll post you the parts plus some notes. Won't be more than five dollars, if that. My shout.

[Patrick]

Very informative. I have learned a lot. And oh yes, I am using the Canon 1014 Autozoom Electronic. I usually abbreviate it as AE for short. Some more questions - how do I attach the red and black wires to the hook up wires? By the way, is that the official name for that product - 'hook up wire?' I don't suppose this wire comes with the alligator clips already attached?

The hand grip of my Canon 1014 doesn't appear to have rubber on it...luckily! Regardless, I see three screws on the same side of the battery diagram. Should be a smooth operation.

Unfortunately, there are possums around here and they are very curious. All I can do is hope that they don't tamper with the 'equipment.'

[etimh]

They made that 9 volt battery pack for the 1014/814 XL-S--would it work with the 1014 AE, I wonder?

Problem would be finding one. They seem ultra rare.

Good luck.

Tim

[carllooper]

Very informative. I have learned a lot. And oh yes, I am using the Canon 1014 Autozoom Electronic. I usually abbreviate it as AE for short. Some more questions - how do I attach the red and black wires to the hook up wires? By the way, is that the official name for that product - 'hook up wire?' I don't suppose this wire comes with the alligator clips already attached?

The hand grip of my Canon 1014 doesn't appear to have rubber on it...luckily! Regardless, I see three screws on the same side of the battery diagram. Should be a smooth operation.

Unfortunately, there are possums around here and they are very curious. All I can do is hope that they don't tamper with the 'equipment.'

The technical term is, I believe, "hookup wire" or to put it another way, if you used that term with the guy behind the counter he'll know what you mean. If you explain what you need it for, he'll know even better what you mean. You'll want wire the same thickness as the wires from the battery holder, and it comes sheathed in plastic (a variety of colours from which to choose). You typically use your teeth to remove the plastic from the end so as to expose the wire. You can just twist the exposed wires together to make a join, and wrap in insulation tape (which you should also get).

The crocodile clips have a small aperture for threading wire through. You can twist around it to secure a join, but make sure you produce a good join as a loose one will make it difficult for the electrons to flow across the join. Wrap in insulation tape. If you have a soldering iron or want to spend some money on such you can put a drop of solder on all the joins before wrapping in insulation tape.

Be sure to use insulation tape to prevent the black wires touching the red wires as it will "short circuit" the power supply meaning no electrons (energy) going through the camera - the electrons from the battery will have taken the shorter path (circuit).

Possoms. Hmmm. You might consider putting the battery holders in a box of some description but I'd be worried more about the camera.

Carl

ps. if you're unsure about assembling let me know - I can assemble it here (with solder) and post it to you. No problems. But you might find it an enjoyable experience trying it yourself anyway. I certainly do. There isn't much that can go wrong. Soldering is a bit tricky but you'll get the hang of it soon enough. You basically just use the iron to heat up some solder until it becomes liquid and flows onto the join.

[woods01]

My feeling is that they will easily last the length of the project. But to be sure I'd suggest that you setup your camera with fresh batteries and leave it on automatic for a day or maybe a week and then use a multimeter to measure the strength of the batteries.

I'd be more worried about leaving the camera control up to a construction crew member.

[71er]

I'd be more concerned about the power consumption of the camera doing single frames. I have at least one camera manual that states that a set of fresh batteries is good for 8 to 10 cartridges shot at 18 fps but only ONE cartridge when shot entirely on single frame setting. I think the suggestion with the battery pack is the best option.

[Patrick]

I am having second thoughts about doing the battery pack thing. Though I like the whole concept. Yea, enclosing the wires in a box is one thing but likely, there would still be a tiny little bit of exposed wire that is visible between the box and the camera. Perhaps enough for a possum to chew on! And there would probably be enough of a gap for moisture etc to get inside.

I did have the idea of having the side battery chamber cover slightly open and covering the gap with masking tape. When doing a battery change, all that I would have to do is slowly peel back the tape and slide back the loose cover.

I am planning to place barb wire around the camera to deter possums. Though you can never really be certain that this will keep them out. I guess it depends on how determined they are. My gosh, they are crazy animals. They chewed on the seat cover of a tractor on our property. And they will eat soap if it's left outside. They like to crap on things too.

I'd be more worried about leaving the camera control up to a construction crew member.

Haha! Yea, not the best feeling! I will try to be there for every day of the first stage of construction. However, the second stage will be done by my cousin, assisted by his father. So I guess I could place a little bit more trust in them. Additionally, there will likely be two members of my immediate family present during most of the second stage.

I'd be more concerned about the power consumption of the camera doing single frames.

Yea, I guess the main issue is how many single frames are exposed. I plan to shoot about 12 frames per day. The estimated time period of construction is about 4 weeks but Ive allowed for another week in my calculations just in case. So if the camera is shooting for 5 weeks at that frame rate, that makes a total of 420 frames - a running time of close to 17 seconds at 25 fps (after telecine.) And I guess it doesn't really matter if I shoot 420 frames over 5 weeks or 5 hours or 5 minutes. The amount of battery consumption would be the same, right? And I'm fairly confident that 420 frames would not take up much battery power, or much film.

In the past, I have exposed significant portions of film cartridges using single frame shooting and batteries were still in reasonable shape. This might sound a little risky but I'm not using a whole cartridge for this project. Ive used up close to 30 feet with this current cartridge and the remainder would surely be more than enough for what I want to do, even if I go a little over 420 frames.

[carllooper]

Another idea with an external battery pack, would be to introduce a switch in the leads - which effectively becomes a power off/on switch.

Instructions to user (if they can follow such) would then be:

1. Switch camera on.
2. Take a frame.
3. Switch camera off.

Possom protection: Enclose everything, camera and batterys in a box.

CArl

[Patrick]

Well, the project is off. My mother was talking over the phone with the guy who was in charge of the construction crew and mentioned to him about the filming. This guy said that he won't allow it. He said that the people working under him wouldn't be happy about being photographed. This is ridiculous because the camera's lens would be zoomed out to wide angle so any individuals would appear pretty small within the frame. And on top of this, it's filmed in time lapse so each frame would only be viewable for a fraction of a second. But no use pushing my point because I get the impression that I'm dealing with people with a stupid mindset.

Though the main reason the guy was against the filming was that there was the chance that I could get footage of them making mistakes. And if that is the case, then they could potentially be sued. So there you have it...I cannot film the construction of my mother's house on my family's own property...at least the first stage.

The second stage of construction will be done by relatives. If it's okay with them, I think I might film one whole day of the building work in time lapse.

[carllooper]

Though the main reason the guy was against the filming was that there was the chance that I could get footage of them making mistakes. And if that is the case, then they could potentially be sued.

The same thing is motivating the removal of cameras in hospitals during births.

Perhaps someone should try the same argument with the government:

Dear Sir/Madam, I would like to have speed cameras removed because they could catch me speeding.

Carl