Has Super 8 beaten obsolescence?

[Andersens Tears]

So the hardware is obsolete but the format is still here and has survived the format that deposed it - analogue video - which is now itself in obsolescence. No new consumer machines are being made - it has become harder to find software for the lowly VHS.

Saying that I have a fully serviced PHILIPS N1700 VCR-LP video machine in full working order and I recently aquired some still factory sealed blank tapes to use in the machine. Not bad for a domestic video format that became obsolete in 1980.

Super 8 filmstock is still being made - it is still viable - and as long as it is here and the cameras are still viable - has super 8 beaten obsolescence?

Was 1982 the year that brought the most decisive wind of change when VHS, Betamax and lets not forget CVC users laughed at super 8 users and called their equipment junk? Funny how most video equipment from 1982 is useless and super 8 cameras from 1982 still fetch a premium?

[Scotness]

Yeah I think it's surviving - it's ease to load, project and telecine put it a head of 16mm - especially 16mm neg. And it's grain and unique look and feel mean it's not competing with HD video, like 16mm is.

As long as the cameras hold out there should always be some form of Super 8 stock around imho

Scot

[Andreas Wideroe]

It's all up to us: As long as we keep buying and shooting Super8 film there will be Super8 film available.

/Andreas

[superadio]

I think maybe cameras gona be a problem. They start geting old, and i have seen much ruined film due to camera malfunction. The late S8 models have soon reached maximum life length. Maybe Standard 8 have more stabile cameras around soon. The old wind up models are fantastic, and simple to use.

[mad*one]

I think some old techniques are surviving, although there are no 100% hard reasons for that.
I'm always a bit surprised that some people state that the Super 8 format is so much better than modern standards. I really dont think, that the "Superiority" of the format is the reason why it is still alive.

(By the way: I think the same about Vinyl: In my opinion, its not alive, because its really superior to digital techniques. And many people make a religious war about those questions...)

When i'm projecting a film for my friends (they are no Super8-addicts) they really like it. And I think mostly, because its looking charming and nice, not because its perfect, and a top-notch HD superimage that perfectly reflects the reality. You can see the limits of the format, the grain, the dirt spots, the slight flickering, the projectors noise, ... its not an "invisible" technique.

I think it survives, because people just like it, including all its disadvantages. It is "love" I'm shure, it can't be an an all-rational decision to shoot Super 8. Well, maybe it is for you, but for me it isn't at all.

Two years ago, I bought an old portable record player, all mechanical, for shellac records, which is terribly cool. It really sounds charming, but i'd never claim: This is so much better quality than a CD. But still, I love this thing, with all its shortcomings.

[Pj]

It's easy, I think that's it's major appeal and the image is pretty good and can be manipulated in so many ways. I agree that cameras can be a problem, but there are so many out there. I hope that some day soon someone will make a new Super 8 camera. The good thing is that Super 8 film is being made and there's quite a few stocks to choose, but I'm sure one day soon the big manufaturers of film might decide that it's not worth making film for Super 8. So until then we should make the most of Super 8 and use it as often as we can.

P

[aj]

Strictly spoken it isn't.

Kodak is updating the product line of Super-8 materials and there are now types of film which didn't exist in S8 in the 1980-ies. Unfortunately the recent update aslo meant the loss of plus-x
Also there are other types of S8 film from Wittner. Which wasn't the case either in the 1980-ies.

For the non business users the prices per minute are becoming somewhat steep.

The main worry is if course that there no newly manufactured cameras
Although there is still an ocean of unused cameras. Condition of these is degrading though.

The best way to keep it positive is to buy and use materials

[avortex]

Nearly all cameras and projectors can be restored and mantained. For example, www.microdeltabalears.com does a terrific job on this. And these machines use to be much more durable than the digital ones.

Keep shooting on film while you can!

[Will2]

The old wind up models are fantastic, and simple to use.

My growing set of Canon Canonet Cine cameras still work great after 45 years and they are battery powered.

I think Super 8 will be around for a while, but eventually may go away before 16mm just because of the customized cartridges. 16mm will be easier to make once Kodak goes away and doesn't provide the Super 8 cartridge anymore.

[bolextech]

The format itself seems to have beaten obsolescence.
The equipment however is another story.

Most cameras were manufactured between 1965 and 1980, 30 to 45 years ago.
Some of the better brands and models of cameras can still be repaired on a case by case basis. If defective parts must be replaced to complete the repair, this can be more complicated as the supply exhausts itself. Often parts must be cannibalized from other defective cameras.

I currently see no shortage of cameras available in the marketplace.
Some filmmakers seem surprised and disappointed when their equipment fails.
They will discard a malfunctioning piece of equipment then search for a replacement which will, like its predecessor, soon have its own set of failures.
People who take super8 filmmaking seriously are aware that they need to budget for equipment maintenance occasionally.
Cameras, like everything, will malfunction sooner or later.

I regularly service 16mm equipment manufactured before super8 even existed.
They can be made to function as good as new with proper maintenance.

Cheers,
Jean-Louis

[Matthew Buick]

Personally, I don't at all believe that Super 8 is obsolete. It's completely outlasted not only the analogue video formats that replaced it, but the analogue formats that replaced them, and looks very much in with a chance of outlasting Mini DV too! :mrgreen: Super 8 just lasts so well! There is a lot of fresh film available in many different types, not to mention a new Super 8 camera, currently being produced in North Korea. I'd say, if Kodak is still showing an interest, then Super 8mm's future is secure for at least ten more years.

Just my two cents!

[superadio]

not to mention a new Super 8 camera, currently being produced in North Korea.
Just my two cents!

Interesting. Do you have any fuurther information about this camera?

[Blue Audio Visual]

Do you have any fuurther information about this camera?

It's an urban legend.

[Matthew Buick]

not to mention a new Super 8 camera, currently being produced in North Korea.
Just my two cents!

Interesting. Do you have any fuurther information about this camera?

It's mentioned on Wikipedia, in the 'Super 8mm' article, and has reputedly been confirmed to exist by a North Korean embassy. Apparently a mysterious Super 8 camera has been turning up in far eastern and pacific rim camera shops for a while now, apart from that, I know nothing. If it exists, I doubt it really pushes 8mm film another step. Call me silly, but I'd really love to own a Super 8 camera that's younger then me!! :mrgreen:

[Blue Audio Visual]

It's mentioned on Wikipedia

Well I take it all back then, if it's mentioned on Wikipedia then it must be true, mustn't it???

After all it's not like any old Tom, Dick or Harry can edit the Wikipedia page, is it???