Diy telecine unit

[MovieStuff]

I have DodCap version 1.36 and a purchase order for the license key.

I swapped PCs last year and haven't reloaded DodCap yet and had forgotten the name CineCap existed. I just installed on my laptop to make sure I could still license the software, tada, it worked.

Is there anyway for valid users to purchase updates/upgrades or to go to CineCap? OBTW what is the latest version?

Sure. Just email Jeff and ask him. He won't turn away previous CineCap customers. There are several versions. 1.42 I believe is the latest (relatively speaking). There is a whole new CineCap Pro based on the Velocity UI that will be released in the near future. It will be (groan) Vista compatible.

Roger

[Uppsala BildTeknik]

This is a private sale of a custom built transfer unit. I am not a commercial seller and I am not affiliated with any other individual or company. Because the unit uses a machine built in the 70’s I cannot offer any guarantees as to its future operational reliability.

Absolutley true...and your point is ?

My point is that you definetly cannot compare the price of a professionally built machine with full warranty, taxes and everyting fully paid for, to the price of a homebuilt thingy that has no warranty and where the seller doesen´t need to pay any taxes.

You are not comparing the price of similar products. Your machine lacks a lot, warranty being one of them.

Hey have you been looking at my tax return.. 8O

I live in the real world

No need to, you already made it clear that you are selling this machine in a way that makes me 100% certain that you won´t be paying income taxes. That lets you have a lot more profit per unit.

As for living in the real world, I´m not sure you are. If you cannot understand why the software it being made a WP only, you need to read the thread from the beginning.

[MovieStuff]

Ronnoco, let's start this conversation all over again. I have absolutely no problem with you building and selling a unit. I have never interfered with anyone doing that on ebay for the last 8 years. I do not see your unit as a knock-off. I have stated my concerns very clearly. If any of this seems aimed at you, it is not intentional. But I do take exception to your position that my units are overpriced when they are so affordable that business customers don't want to reveal to their clients what they are using for fear that they will just go buy one of my units rather than pay to have their home movies transferred. If I had really just been interested in money, I would have a far more efficient business model that left out the needs of my clients, service, warranty or the needs of the DIY crowd. If I seem a bit testy, it is because I have been dealing with an endless stream of knock-off assholes that are irate that they can't get software that they seem to think they have a god-given right to. My apologies if you've been caught in the scatter shot. Good luck with your auction and I think you will find that your design will work better if you move the micro-switch to a rotary, adjustable timing disk and away from the film path.

Roger

[granfer]

Nice to see all the feathers back where they should be!

Ronnoco, I add my good wishes to your further experiments; I also am an experimenter. If you search all the threads on this forum you will find lots more of us, all with something to add to the melting pot. And just as we have all learnt from Roger's generous advice I am also sure that he also has learnt from others' experiences along the way.
There is a lot more to Transfer than just building a machine; there is a lot more to be learnt from the use of different cameras, different processing and editing software and different computer configurations. You've also discovered the bottom line... don't use the kitchen table! I don't know how old you are or how long you've been married, but the truth is , in the real world (just kidding) it's what "her indoors" says, that goes. Never, ever, forget that, and fiddle yourself a proper place to escape to do your experimenting.
If I can add anything from my experience, Email or PM me.

Granfer

[ronnoco]

Hey Roger

No worries mate

Thank you very much for your kind advice about improving the design of my DIY unit..much appreciated.

I had no idea that my putting the unit up for sale on ebay would kindle such controvesy....I am certain that your customers are completely satisfied with your great looking units and the very comprehensive after sales service you provide for them...just wish I could afford one !

Not for one moment did I feel I had the right to purchase any particular software package...I admit I was somewhat disappointed when it became unavailable after my recommendations about it to potential bidders...not to worry...

Good luck to you too

[telesync]

Just a shame that the guy who wrote Cinecap will loose out on a few sales.

But not as many as if he left it up. I helped to develop CineCap. Jeff wrote the software based on many trials and experiments that we did together and used a lot of my input into the architecture of the software. For the last 7 years, it has been publicly available to anyone that was a DIY person or experimenter. We did not care about that at all. But then some people started occasionally building and selling their own versions of the WorkPrinters and Snipers. Again, that is something that we tolerated. But then they started selling multiple copies of our units and we suspected they were also selling pirated versions of the software. These people had no shame and were going so far as to actually copy entire sections of my copyrighted website.

If you have people who copying entire sections of your website, then you can go after them and file suit. But, Jeff's software business will ultimately suffer in sales now that they only sell to people with specific telecine units. I just found out about this today, and after shipping 4 units this week, I now have to call people and send them to another software site. (that's $276 Jeff loses this week alone from my company who has consistantly recommended his software to our customers).

Beyond the obvious legal issues, there were some practical issues that we needed to control. These WorkPrinter knock-offs being offered looked exactly like mine but the people selling them never offered a warranty or customer service. They just snatched the money and ran. This has been quietly going on now for a couple of years. The occasional sale of a knock-off doesn't affect my bottom line. However, when multiple copies of these second-rate units end up being resold to someone else and then they have a problem and contact us thinking they have a MovieStuff unit and are dissapointed we won't help them or someone on another forum starts talking about our products and the person with the now-malfunctioning MovieStuff clone potentially posts, "I have one of those. They suck."....Now THAT'S an obvious problem.

I can see your point if someone is trying to sell units and make the public think they come from moviestuff. I've been self-employed for the past 28 years and have had similar experiences. Usually the best way is to contact the Attorney General in your state, and cc the Attorney General in the state where the person is doing business. You'd be surprised how fast people will change their stripes after getting an inquiry from the Attorney Generals office.

Also, I am sure you have seen people selling their WorkPrinters on ebay. Well, what you probably don't know is that only 1 out of about 4 are really legit. The others are people selling nothing. They don't have a WorkPrinter of any kind and are just selling a photo they snatched from my website. They never had a WorkPrinter and were just running a scam because they know our units hold their value.

Most telecine units hold their value, and at any one time there are probably 1000 different scams on ebay. It's not limited to your unit. One way to deter this would be to assign a serial number for each unit, then include a search at your site where people buying these could run a search of the serial number to see if in fact it is a legitimate number.

Removing CineCap and CaptureMate from public availability means it is easy for us to find these people that are selling pirated versions of the software because all we have to do is make an anonymous phone call or email to them, ask where we can get the software, and if they say they will sell a copy of the software along with the unit, then we can legally shut them down. As you have noted, there are alternatives out there and if someone is determined enough, they will figure out a way to get around the issue. But, legally, for me to protect my business, I had to show due diligence in addressing this matter or I lose my right to certain legal remedies later on due to complacency.

Pirated software has been going on even before the internet was started. Years ago I wrote several payment processing software programs, and found out that one was pirated by a major US corporation! And they were reselling it! Hackers are always going to be around, so updating the software and changing the algorithm is the best way to deter hacking. Jeff's company will ultimately lose money because you are trying to fend off competition from yours.

I am sorry this makes it more difficult but you can thank people like this guy, who has made a CineMate knock off that he says is frame by frame but implies uses CineCap and CaptureMate, even though it requires no computer! :roll:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0292492420

I read his item description and it appears his units work the same as mine. You can film direct to capture by adjusting the speed, or frame-by-frame. I also have a unit up on ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0299980403

At this point, we are discussing releasing a version of the software for DIY experimenters with an agreement for non-resale and use only for the unit they have built for themselves. But the days of a free-ride for people selling knock offs is over. Sorry for any inconvenience, guys. But I should have done this a couple of years ago. Roger

I'm sorry but all you are doing is hurting Jeff's business because you are upset that you have some competition. There are other software programs out there and companies like mine will simply switch to referring our customers to another vendor, or write our own software. You may have built the first frame-by-frame unit, but you don't hold any patents on it (can only be done if you manufacture the projector itself, my patent attorney already checked it out). Competition is healthy for everyone and if Henry Ford was still the only company making Automobiles we'd all probably be paying about $100,000 per car right now!

The days of $5000+ telecine units for small film transfer companies are about over, and with the economy heading south, companies like mine will manage to survive by cutting costs and selling affordable telecine units, with or without CineCap software.

Best Regards,

Scott Vining
JMS Movies

[MovieStuff]

If you have people who copying entire sections of your website, then you can go after them and file suit.

I could but is it worth my time? There are more efficient and direct ways of dealing with this sort of thing.

But, Jeff's software business will ultimately suffer in sales now that they only sell to people with specific telecine units.

Not really. Jeff and I talk every day. He's a very good friend and we compared the number of sales for the year generated by my units and the difference generated by outside sales. The difference was only about 50 orders or less for the year compared to hundreds of sales from my units.

I can see your point if someone is trying to sell units and make the public think they come from moviestuff.

That is my main point of contention. There are other concerns, as well, but they sort of get tidied up by dropping public access to the software.

Hackers are always going to be around,...

True. But is kind of irrelevant to the situation.

Jeff's company will ultimately lose money because you are trying to fend off competition from yours.

See above.

I'm sorry but all you are doing is hurting Jeff's business...

Apparently that's not the only business I'm hurting.

... because you are upset that you have some competition.

Oh please. I'm not that thin-skinned. I have had competition since the first year I started making money selling telecine units. For every CineMate I sell, there are probably 50 people that buy a simple variable speed projector and shoot off a screen. Eliminating competition and cornering the market is clearly not what this is about.

You may have built the first frame-by-frame unit, but you don't hold any patents on it

.

Never claimed to. But product identity does fall under intellectual property rights via the Langham Act and does protect the general look and style of my units, even without a patent and even if I used a previously made projector.

Competition is healthy for everyone....

Depends on how you define competition. If competition is defined by doing R&D and creating something new for the market place, then I would agree. If competition is defined as simply copying someone else's design to save money then that isn't going to produce anything new. Then the market suffers due to lack of variety. To me "competition" means moving faster due to innovation; not running at the same speed due to a lack of self motivation.

The days of $5000+ telecine units for small film transfer companies are about over....

Really? I guess my customers didn't get the memo.

Roger

[telesync]

You may have built the first frame-by-frame unit, but you don't hold any patents on it

.

Never claimed to. But product identity does fall under intellectual property rights via the Langham Act and does protect the general look and style of my units, even without a patent and even if I used a previously made projector.

I think you mean the Lanham (Trademark) Act. I rather doubt that would hold water as none of the components were manufactured by your company (ie; GAF projector, ccd camera, etc). If that were the case, then anyone who aimed a ccd camera at a GAF projector would be in violation. Easy case for any junior attorney to get thrown out.

Competition is healthy for everyone....

Depends on how you define competition. If competition is defined by doing R&D and creating something new for the market place, then I would agree. If competition is defined as simply copying someone else's design to save money then that isn't going to produce anything new. Then the market suffers due to lack of variety. To me "competition" means moving faster due to innovation; not running at the same speed due to a lack of self motivation.

True, I remember when I bought my first hard-drive in 1988, it was $1200 for a 1 meg drive! Now you can buy a 500 Gig drive for about $100. Competition brought down the price, but a hard drive still Reads-Writes and Records data. Telecine units are not much different, you can get them to improve picture quality and speed, but in the end, they are still doing the same thing.. copying film to a hard drive. Not exactly rocket science.

The days of $5000+ telecine units for small film transfer companies are about over....

Really? I guess my customers didn't get the memo.

Roger

Get back to me at the end of 2009.

Enjoy the weekend,

Scott

[MovieStuff]

You may have built the first frame-by-frame unit, but you don't hold any patents on it

.

Never claimed to. But product identity does fall under intellectual property rights via the Langham Act and does protect the general look and style of my units, even without a patent and even if I used a previously made projector.

I think you mean the Lanham (Trademark) Act.

Nope. The Langham act (with a "g") deals in distinctive traits of a product or personage and the consequences of effect to their reputation or standing within a community or industry. To put it simply: If someone were to try to capitalize on their resemblance to, say, John Travolta and passed themselves off as such, even if they didn't say they were John Travolta, that would be a violation of the Langham Act.

If that were the case, then anyone who aimed a ccd camera at a GAF projector would be in violation.

If it looked like mine and they capitalized on the confusion it creates, then in fact they are. If they build something that looks markedly different, then they aren't. It's really pretty simple and, so far, 4 different attorneys have advised their knock-off clients to cease and desist without a fight. This isn't my first rodeo, Scott. ;)

I just decided I was tired of paying an attorney just so people making DIY units could still have access to the software. If there is another software available for them to use, then I guess I'm not stepping on anyone's toes.

Competition is healthy for everyone....

Depends on how you define competition. If competition is defined by doing R&D and creating something new for the market place, then I would agree. If competition is defined as simply copying someone else's design to save money then that isn't going to produce anything new. Then the market suffers due to lack of variety. To me "competition" means moving faster due to innovation; not running at the same speed due to a lack of self motivation.

True, I remember when I bought my first hard-drive in 1988, it was $1200 for a 1 meg drive! Now you can buy a 500 Gig drive for about $100. Competition brought down the price, but a hard drive still Reads-Writes and Records data. Telecine units are not much different, you can get them to improve picture quality and speed, but in the end, they are still doing the same thing..

It isn't what the unit does but how it does it that makes the difference. All cars go 60 miles an hour. How fast you get to 60 is the selling point and how it looks defines the product. If form follows function, then copying one is usually an attempt to copy the other. Deliberate market confusion in doing so is a violation of the Langham Act.

copying film to a hard drive. Not exactly rocket science.

No but people still can't seem to figure it out for themselves, otherwise this thread wouldn't exist.

The days of $5000+ telecine units for small film transfer companies are about over....

Really? I guess my customers didn't get the memo.

Get back to me at the end of 2009.

We're already well past our expectations for this quarter. We sold and shipped 36+ HD 8mm Sniper units at $8495 and 5 16mm Sniper HD units at $8995. In fact, I've been so busy selling $5000+ telecine units to small film transfer companies I haven't had to time to put our new HD product line on the website. Should have it up long before the end of 2009, though. ;)

Roger

[telesync]

Nope. The Langham act (with a "g") deals in distinctive traits of a product or personage and the consequences of effect to their reputation or standing within a community or industry. To put it simply: If someone were to try to capitalize on their resemblance to, say, John Travolta and passed themselves off as such, even if they didn't say they were John Travolta, that would be a violation of the Langham Act.

What does that have to do with using a GAF projector and placing a camera in front of it?

If that were the case, then anyone who aimed a ccd camera at a GAF projector would be in violation.

If it looked like mine and they capitalized on the confusion it creates, then in fact they are. If they build something that looks markedly different, then they aren't. It's really pretty simple and, so far, 4 different attorneys have advised their knock-off clients to cease and desist without a fight. This isn't my first rodeo, Scott. ;)

I LOVE Rodeo's, let them take a look at my B&H telecine projector and let's see who can stay on the horse the longest!

I just decided I was tired of paying an attorney just so people making DIY units could still have access to the software. If there is another software available for them to use, then I guess I'm not stepping on anyone's toes.

Yeah, no problem, but when you cancel it and inform nobody, and screw me and my customers (who have bought at least 25 copies this year alone), that is a problem. You claim you are "helping Jeff" but really you are trying to eliminate competition because you realize this is going to be a lean year. It's amazing that the same day I started selling my units to the public on eBay, you had a meeting with Jeff and force fed him into agreeing with you to only sell his software to YOUR customers. You are a greety bastard, and my only hope is that you honor your word. I've read this message board for years, and your ego is the only reason I have never registered, UNTIL today. You have reached a new low, your know-it-all ego is falling apart, and my company will be the leader in telecine sales for 2009. Wanna bet your Rodeo horse on it?

[MovieStuff]

I just decided I was tired of paying an attorney just so people making DIY units could still have access to the software. If there is another software available for them to use, then I guess I'm not stepping on anyone's toes.

Yeah, no problem, but when you cancel it and inform nobody, and screw me and my customers (who have bought at least 25 copies this year alone), that is a problem.

Sorry for any inconvenience but I wasn't aware I was required to inform anyone but my clients about it and there is a notice on my website when you click on the software link. But since there is other software available, how is that screwing you?

You claim you are "helping Jeff" but really you are trying to eliminate competition because you realize this is going to be a lean year.

Oh for heaven's sake, learn the market. If anything, my orders and your orders should go up in times like this, Scott. People look around and say, "Hmmm, I wonder how I can make some money on the side. I know, I'll start transferring home movies." Then they start looking for resources and ebay is the first place they look. If I wanted to "eliminate the competition", don't you think I would have already been selling on ebay? I don't sell on ebay and never have and never will. The way I see it, you pretty much have the jump on any prospective sale I have. So how am I a threat to you? We don't even market in the same turf.

It's amazing that the same day I started selling my units to the public on eBay
you had a meeting with Jeff and force fed him into agreeing with you to only sell his software to YOUR customers.

OMG. You think this is all about you?

LOL, Scott, it was Jeff that long ago first suggested limiting sales because he doesn't do this full time and was concerned about the number of customers he'd eventually have to deal with. It was my insistance that kept it available to DIY people like you all this time. You don't have to thank me but, please, get a grip. Jeff can do as he pleases and if he feels that he's losing too many sales as a result of this decision then he can sell to whomever he wants. He doesn't work for me and, if anything, I am beholden to him. Without this new Velocity software, my Sniper series won't work at all. It's the only software that will work! So your notion that I've forced him to do something against his will is totally misplaced. This was a mutual decision based on a discussion that started long before you listed on ebay. There were many factors considered and none of them involved you.

You are a greety bastard,

Well I've never been called a bastard for how I greeted someone but everyone has a right to their opinion.

Seriously, let's get something straight: I was instrumental in the overall design of "CineCap". Jeff wrote the software based on many hours of meetings and experimentations. It was a joint effort. It was not written for your unit or anyone else's. As noted on my website for the last 8 years, CineCap was written specifically for my equipment. However, it was by my desire to help the DIY crowd that I felt CineCap should be available to the general public. If I was the "greety bastard" that you think I am, CineCap would have never been available for general release at all. Again, you don't have to thank me but let's get some perspective on the situation. The notion that I "screwed you" because I decided to protect my investment without consulting you first is insulting and uncalled for. Besides, I don't recall a heads up from you when you decided to start selling your own telecine unit. ;)

..and my only hope is that you honor your word.

I always do. That's how I've made my reputation in a competitive marketplace.

I've read this message board for years, and your ego is the only reason I have never registered, UNTIL today. You have reached a new low, your know-it-all ego is falling apart, and my company will be the leader in telecine sales for 2009. Wanna bet your Rodeo horse on it?

Whatever. I have no idea why you are so pissed but I hope that your company does really well, Scott.

Roger

[reflex]

Scott, you'll have to forgive me for not knowing who the hell you are. However, I have a pretty good sense of Roger "Greedy Bastard" Evans. I know several of his customers extremely well, and they've received consistent support from him over the years. That's incredibly important when working with old equipment because it will malfunction sooner or later.

Roger didn't earn his reputation by attacking others - he earned it through word of mouth behind the scenes. I suggest you do the same.

[Uppsala BildTeknik]

What does that have to do with using a GAF projector and placing a camera in front of it?

Well I´d suggest you read The Langham act (with a "g"), and find out. Or even better, get a lawyer to do it so you make sure that you understand it correctly.

I LOVE Rodeo's, let them take a look at my B&H telecine projector and let's see who can stay on the horse the longest!

I suggest you make it more clear how your warranty policy is. If I remember correctly you only guaranteed that the telecine unit would be fully functional on arrival.

Sounds like a worthless warranty to me.

when you cancel it and inform nobody, and screw me and my customers....you had a meeting with Jeff and force fed him into agreeing with you....You are a greety bastard, and my only hope is that you honor your word.

You are so wrong I don´t know where to begin! Seriously, how the hell did Roger screw YOUR clients? Has he agreed to serve your clients in any way? I don´t think so.

Did Roger give his word that he would support your clients if they have trouble with their poorly built telecine units, or did he agree to sell them the capturing software? Please, search for the email where he promised all this and show us all with a quote. Just for laughs! :lol:

I've read this message board for years, and your ego is the only reason I have never registered, UNTIL today.

My guess is you had no idea this message board existed years ago. If you had, you´d know that Roger is very helpful, has a good reputation and is very knowledgeful.

How about you? Well until now you have proven to be a an asshole. Nobody wants to deal with assholes, so please straighten up and get real. :roll:

And stop riding piggyback on other companies products. Try to earn a good reputation, as Roger has. Reputation is everything, and your is going down the drain like a rocket. Well at least you are good at something, driving you company down in the dirt! :roll:

[ronnoco]

[quote="Upsala]How about you? Well until now you have proven to be a an asshole. Nobody wants to deal with assholes, so please straighten up and get real. [/quote]

You really are a very unpleasant person...you have contributed nothing to this thread except to insult and berate other members... :?

[Uppsala BildTeknik]

you have contributed nothing to this thread except to insult and berate other members.

Oh, but I have. I have contributed with objective eyes. I have no interest in selling Moviestuffs products, nor do I have any interest in buying nor building DIY machines.

Now, again, could you please explain to me how Roger screwed your clients?
I still can´t understand how you can say something like that.

Roger has nothing to do with the ones who has bought, or might buy, your equipment. Correct?