Ikonoskop DII: discussion on new camera

[steve hyde]

...I don't know if this camera is ready yet, but I'm intrigued. It's the new Ikonoskop digi-cam - sporting a super 16 size sensor and in PL mount.

unclear about the robustness of the recording format etc.

http://www.ikonoskop.com/dii/


anybody know any more news about this thing? Last I heard it isn't ready yet.

Cool idea to be able to shoot digital with S16 lenses native.

[Nigel]

I'm with you...

It looks cool but I really want more beta on it.

Good Luck

[Rachel Oliver]

Hi;

Yeah I've been watching this from the shadows for a while too, I really like the Ikonoskop vibe. I guess it's comparable to what Red is doing with the scarlet but Ikonoskop just have a real eye for design, this little thing looks more like an a-minima than a machine vision brick with a lens... It's supposed to begin shipping at the end of this month so it will be v interesting to start seeing some results and reactions from early adopters. Prepare for filmshooting to get flooded with posts from video camera kids asking for info on old cheap cine lenses...

Regards

[Scotness]

As video cameras go it's probably going to be good - BUT I note they don't list it's exposure lattitude in the tech specs. After watching Apocalypto - which was shot on a 4k Dalsa I think - I'm pretty sus on all these cameras - Apocalypto looked like it was shot on a camcorder.

[Rachel Oliver]

Hi;

He he Yes I know what your saying, the level of dillusion with these new semi existent cameras and the current "Ultra HD super cameras that will save the world" is quite high. I watched something on the BBC that was shot with red one and it looked great in parts, very organic but in a few scenes especially with hi con daylight exteriors we were suddenly in "electronic video world", very jarring.
I still find the Ikonoskop interesting though for the right project it could be a very cool digital tool with a strong nod to more of a classic film camera design and ergonomic,
It even has PL or C mount and could be matched with some old cine primes etc which would be fun....
PS one of the Ikonoskop designers has been quoted at 11 stops lattitude for the DII.

Regards

[Blue Audio Visual]

There are a number of cameras in the pipeline which will work fine with S16 and some 16mm lenses, a 2/3" chip being smaller than S16.

http://www.pstechnik.de/en/digitalfilm-si2k-mini.php

This is available now, and it uses the IMS ('Interchangeable Mount System') which includes PL & C-Mounts amongst others

And of course the Ikonoscop and the Red Scarlet...

http://www.red.com/epic_scarlet

...expect a surge of interest in 16mm glass next year...

[Rachel Oliver]

Hi;

Slumdog millionaire (Danny Boyle's new flick) was shot partly with the si2K Mini. It's higher price point sepperates it from the DII and Scarlet camps a little.

I agree about the potential surge in cine glass sales, especially older 16mm glass that's quite cheap these days, prices may start to rise.

I also predict many complaints from people splashing out on Industrial TV lenses that don't have the correct mounts or advertised resolution ability and RX cine lenses that won't focus properly on these cams....

Regards

[avr]

The concept of the A-Cam dII is very good. A small and portable camera, 16mm lenses, 2K resolution and RAW. All for 7000 euro which includes one memory "mag" which is preety good thinking in expensive cameras like Sony HD Cam SR, Arri D-20, Genesis, etc

[reflex]

Geez. You guys have missed the big news here! The DII's CCD sensor is manufactured by Kodak.

The problem is that Ikonoskop faces an uphill battle, since other manufacturers will be able to incorporate the same sensor in their own equipment. There's no unique intellectual property involved and it's only a short matter of time before equipment like the DII is available cheaply everywhere.

Both Nikon and Canon have unveiled DSLRs that can capture HD video. This is problematic for Canon, because they don't want to undercut their existing pro and prosumer camcorder lineups. However, Nikon has no such problem. They can easily develop a DSLR with semi-pro audio capability (and a more camcorder-like form factor) that would very effectively steal sales away from Canon, Sony and Panasonic.

Of course, there's also the challenge of handling uncompressed video. Sure, a DII costs "only" €7K, but you'll need an extremely powerful computer to handle an uncompressed 2K project. Yes, I know you can use an intermediate codec for editing, but color grading, post fx and rendering will be an enormous challenge.

[Nigel]

The "HD" that you get from the Nikon or Canon is not what I would call HD...

It might be fine for taking some video of your trip to the beer store but beyond that it seems to fall flat. Look up the real specs of what the DSLRs can do. It ain't so special.

Good Luck

[reflex]

It might be fine for taking some video of your trip to the beer store but beyond that it seems to fall flat. Look up the real specs of what the DSLRs can do. It ain't so special.

Yeah. 720p, CMOS sensor with rolling shutter issues, mono 22kHz sound without external inputs, focus/zoom limitations while shooting, etc.

But it's the first step back toward truly affordable video equipment with interchangeable lenses. That's pretty damn exciting, coz I'm sick of tiny $1000 camcorders with smeary touchscreens, pencil eraser-sized zoom toggles, and "manual focus" rings that seem to have fallen off some kid's Fisher Price toy.

[steve hyde]

...interesting about the Kodak sensor. I didn't catch that. I have no intentions of running out to buy one of these and really think shooting on celluloid is the surest way to get vibrant imagery, but I would like to have one lens set that works on both digital and celluloid cameras and this new Ikonoskop looks like it is designed to mix with Super 16. Cool idea.

[sarmoti]

I own a RED one camera so I might be a bit biased. Apart from producing exceptional images RED has achieved something very important which is direct integration with the leading NLE software and DI solutions. There are far more RED cameras out there (5000+) than all the DALSA, SI, ARRI D20/D21, Panavision Genesis and Sony F23's combined.

The Nikon and Canon SLRs incorporate video almost as an afterthought and both have severe limitations with audio, control, recording time and rolling shutter and visible compression artifacts. They are still cameras that can do video (with 35mm DOF), and while you can capture some pretty nice images with them, you do so with serious compromises you need to work around.

As far as the Ikonoscop, we'll have to see if it delivers in terms of image quality. My vote of confidence is for the RED Scarlet since I've seen first hand what RED delivers (and continues to deliver via firmware and software updates). Not only that but RED has been an extremely generous and supportive company, they are taking in their current cameras as trade ins (at full purchase value) towards their new models when they start shipping. Another plus is that RED already has an extensive list of third party companies manufacturing accessories and software tools for their products.

[damienparis]

That could be the ultimate Sensor for DIY telecine!
I'm interested in everything about DIY T.C these last few days according to what Freddy Van de Putte uploaded to vimeo.
I want to buy a small affordable HD camera and a good sensor for TC, I'm looking forward to see the first previews of the iconscope & the Scarlette to compare.

[reflex]

I downloaded the demo shots from the Ikonoskop site and did some quick color grading on them. I appreciate seeing the "raw" video straight from the sensor, but it can cause people to say, "Eww, that looks bland and video-like."

I gave each of the three sequences (driving, watch and lab) a distinctly different look. The original lab sequence was poorly exposed, so I pulled it back. There's lots of detail (even in the compressed version on the web) and I'm sure you could do tons with the original RAW file.

I uploaded a compilation of the tweaks to Blip.tv for your viewing pleasure:

http://blip.tv/file/1575709/

I'd love to shoot a short with this camera.