reloadable cartridge questions

[filman]

1) my Lomo developing tank is capable of 10 mt of film only, so how can i know in total darkness when to cut the film before to load it in the cartridge ?

2) my Sony Digital 8 cam has infrared shooting capability, now can i use this function, with its built in infrared illuminator, to operate w/o to impress the film (color and b/w) ? i connect the video output to Sony Glasstron monitor glass, so no visible light dispersion.

thanks in advance
Roberto

[James E]

I'd be careful w/ using IR near cine film. Due to it's panchromatic sensitivity even the smallest amount of light could fog your film. I actually fogged some film using IR LED's due to the fact that they have a small amount of red visable light. My Sony does the same thing. I've not tested it yet to see if it puts of any visable light but you might try putting it in IR mode taking it into your dark room, closing your eyes for 90 seconds then look directly into the IR light on the front of the camera. If you can see any visable light at all it will likely fog the film. Color for sure. you might get away w/ it w/ B&W film.

As to your 10m/40' LOMO tank, Sell it and get a 50' tank. They were mainly used for regular 8mm and and single 8mm (Not Fuji single8) as they had lengths under that amount.

If that's not an option, take some leader or other "junk" film and run it through your projector watching the frame counter for the correct length each number =18 frames. Someone here I'm sure knows the correct math. Let it wind onto an empty 50' reel until you have 40'. Tape it down and get a feel for how much that is in the dark and or also cut some notches into the reel you can easily identify in the dark.

Before loading your Kaceema (I'm presuming) spool your fresh film onto your specially marked reel until it's fill to the right length. Then cut, put away your bulk stock, and spool it onto the core and load it into the cart.
Bob's your uncle.....
Cheers,

[gianni1]

I would guess the smaller lomo tank reel takes up about two thirds of the super 8 cartridge. You could just shoot half a cart (or two thirds), then snip the film, masking tape the unused film to the cartridge, and unspool the exposed half of film (in the dark) onto the Lomo reel and process it.

Then with the masking tape repair the cartridge remaining film splice and finish the other half (one third) of the cart for later processing. Repeat this until you find one of the bigger Lomo tanks, or skip the "feeding the film onto the reel" bit and just stuff it into the tank and process it spaghetti / bucket style.

Gianni 8)

[filman]

thanks for the infos.
Wittner sells on his websites http://www.wittner-kinotechnik.de/katal ... roller.php this kind of infrared glasses. it is stated 950 nm infrared light. would be interesting to know how is the infrared emitter of the Sony D8.

[aj]

thanks for the infos.
Wittner sells on his websites http://www.wittner-kinotechnik.de/katal ... roller.php this kind of infrared glasses. it is stated 950 nm infrared light. would be interesting to know how is the infrared emitter of the Sony D8.

Don't bother with these things. Standard darkroom work and this film roller can easily be done by training yourself a bit in lowlight and then execute the drill in the dark.

People have been working in the photographic darkroom for some 150years without nightvision and you certainly don´t need it for this amateur stuff.

BTW the screen which you use to display the image will emit visible light and certainly fog your film. Or are you going to watch a recording afterwards

[filman]

i have tried ,time ago, to develop cine film but i made a disaster loading the developing tank. if the technology, after 150 years, can help us, well why not .
BTW, i would see the image via Sony Glasstron, similar look like nightvision, so no light dispersion. the main problem is the infrared illuminator that is visible in total darkness, as reported from James E.
regards

[James E]

I think I just figured out how to solve you delimma w/ the length of your LOMO only being 10m. Is it a dual reel LOMO? Mine is. So I can actually do two 15m lengths at a time. If your lomo is a dual reel setup then just spool on the bottom reel until full, back it off a bit, cut, then load the balance of the film onto the top reel, splice it together after devloping, Bob's your uncle.
FYI here's how I load the reels so that the film doesn't bunch up.
Once you've put the film in the center retainer if you're right handed hold the film in place w/ your left hand while you fit the top reel, or retaining reel on top. With your R hand turn the spool of film toward you at a 45 degree angle so it's laying at a back angle. After fitting the top reel on hold the spool of film in your R hand below the level of the reel at a 45 degree angle. Turn the LOMO reel w/ your left hand. The angle and being lower than the LOMO reel helps it load into the reel smoothly w/out bunching up. Wear tight form fitting latex gloves to handel the film. You can also put a cotton film glove on the hand you're holding the spool of film in so it unwinds smoothly in your hand.
Happy Processing,

[aj]

Do you have a small 30ft LOMO with two deck spirals???

Here are some images for the loading instructions:

http://www.geocities.com/cinetank/s8-16 ... ual-s8.htm


Anybody using this one

[chachi]

I always crack the cart open with a can opener and take the film out. That loading from the cart thing has always scared me...

[filman]

Thanks very much for the infos. I tried many times with dead film in the environment light and take more practice, but if something goes wrong in total darkness..., anyway my lomo tank is a single spiral 16/DS8, and reversing one side becomes 8mm/S8, so one film per time.
best regards

[aj]

I always crack the cart open with a can opener and take the film out. That loading from the cart thing has always scared me...

Large laboraties never cracked cartridges when the film was sticking out. Like intended by the designers of the cartridge. They merely stacked the carts in guidance cages who fed them into a robot. This robot would pull the film out a bit until the large hole in the film. Then it would hook onto that and yank out the film, cracking the anti-reverse brake. Then it was cut from the cart and taped to a film on a large holder reel and fed onto that. All by the robot in a few seconds

I feed from the cartridge onto the Lomo reel directly but must admit that I push-in the plate a bit to let the film come-out somewhat easier. I lock the film to the core of the reel with light on. It takes some 20cm to pull out first enough to crack the brake too. Then the reel is put on a slow spinning disc and I hold the cartridge like in the picture but somewhat more at an angle with the table. It is important to have the film lean at 45 degrees. Perforation goes into the spiralgroove of the reel. When doing two decks both cartridges are fixed to the core. I first feed in the lower deck. The upper cartridge lies on top of the upper deck and is fed in after the lower which is of course cut from the cartridge

It takes a only few seconds more than the robot

[chachi]

I guess I'll give it a try, I just processed 4 rolls this week that I shoot in 2005. I made a platter to hold the film once removed out of cart using a old cd spindle base and the hub from an old agfa cart. Ektachrome doesn't fit on the hub as good, but it worked ok. I Find that the footage at the end of the roll is usually the footage I like the best. Isn't that the way it is, you run out of film during the best shots. For that reason, I like to save as much of the end of the roll as possible.

I guess I just like making things harder than they really are, lol.


P.S. filman, thats the smaller lomo tank, you can't fit the whole roll on there obviously. measure out how many feet you can fit on there and keep it in mind when your shooting.... That's what I do with 16mm, I keep an eye out for the 50ft mark as thats the maximum I can load in my lomo. If you keep this in mind while shooting, you wont have to cut the film in the middle of a critical scene...

[Angus]

I have the 10m Lomo too....always on the lookout for a cheap auction for the 15m tank.

You can get about 2/3 to 3/4 of your super 8 film at one time into the 10m Lomo. Best guess is to shoot 30 feet and then remove from the cartridge via the "gate" apeture.

[James E]

I have 2 25m dual reel LOMO's. I bought one from Olex in Ukraine and then got lucky and bought a brand new unused one from a guy in the Czech Republic. I really enjoy having complete controll of the process from loading the cart to projection. I'm trying to come up w/ a workflow to be able to do 4 carts in rapid succession. I generally load all of my carts in complete darkness. This way I get absolutely every single frame. Even get frames beyond the big hole at the end. I NEVER load the reel from the cart. Too much tension. Everytime I've tried it it's a mess. I remove the spool and hold it in my hand as I spin the reel.

I've been trying to work out how to build a jig to make the loading go smoother/quicker. The old CD spindle is a great idea and I'm going to try that. I've got a pretty good system set up to warm my chemistry, and keep my tanks in a water bath that keeps all of my chemistry at 101F. I allways get super great results better than I've ever gotten from a lab. I think it's because I'm using fresh chem of course and that I keep my chem at a very consistant temp.

I thought about drainign chem from one tank straigt to the next, but I don't think I could keep up w/ the agitation properly. Plus the tempurature drops a bit too much. So I go all the way through one process putting the chem in a warming water bath in an ice chest in the bath tub. Once I get all of the way one reel and it's set out to dry I start from scratch w/ the next one. It's not bad. Takes me about 3 hours to do the whole thing.

If I had DS8 I could do 400' of film at a time! 200' over two tanks then split! I do have a splitter for my regular 8. Humm... Canon Scoopic DS8 anyone?
Cheers,

[aj]

Here are some tools:
http://www.siltec.co.uk/diydev.html