Moderator: Andreas Wideroe
like i said, dogs like to fight more than cows like to become hamburgers. and the simple act of keeping dogs is slavery. i'm sure the keepers of fighting dogs love and care for their friends at least as much as the average, uh, owner.Kalu wrote:Animal torturing is just something that makes me angry and sad...
ok, and they will do what to stop it? if the commercial doesn't work on the people who either like fighting dogs or don't care, what good does it do?Mitch Perkins wrote:One assumes the PSA was directed at people who do care
Back in the 60s, there were tons of PSAs about anti-littering here in the states. They were quite effective because it got people thinking about what they were doing with their trash. It didn't happen overnight but now people are much more likely to put their trash in a trash can than drop it out the window of their car or on the street. Dog fighting is different in that no one benefits from trash being thrown on the street while dog fighting is an illegal business that usually involves gambling. While I agree that people should have freedom to do as they please, I'm not sure that extends to cruel treatment of animals, which dog fighting surely is. While I do enjoy the occasional burger and admit to the inferred hypocrisy, you have no proof that dogs enjoy fighting each other to the death, which is how dog fighting works, BTW. I like burgers but I find the thought of domesticated dogs being bred to be agressive for a bloodsport to be offensive and cruel. While I do agree that PSAs won't pursuade those that love dog fighting to stop, societal pressures might, just as PSAs against smoking have been very effective at reducing cigarette consumption here in the states. Sometimes it's just a matter of making enough people aware of something that societal changes happen as a result. For instance, due to commercials and documentaries about the beef industry, I don't eat as many burgers as I used to. So this type of programming does work, even if a bit slowly.mattias wrote:ok, and they will do what to stop it? if the commercial doesn't work on the people who either like fighting dogs or don't care, what good does it do?Mitch Perkins wrote:One assumes the PSA was directed at people who do care
you know i love you man, but you're dead wrong on both counts. i really don't have a dog in this hunt... (cough) ...i think there are many more disturbing things that humans do to one another that serve to diminish and demystify the viciousness we seem capable of toward lesser species...mattias wrote:and the simple act of keeping dogs is slavery. i'm sure the keepers of fighting dogs love and care for their friends at least as much as the average, uh, owner.
that's how you define a slave from its owner's point of view. to the slave it doesn't matter for what purpose he's being enslaved. and where i come from many if not most dogs are used for hunting or sheep herding, and if that's not free labor what is. :-)ccortez wrote:on the first count, slavery refers to involuntary servitude. traditional pet "owners" aren't served by their dogs; quite the opposite.
but he was disturbed, you said it yourself. if all dogfighters are disturbed then psychiatry should help more than ads, and otherwise your argument is void.i grew up in the deep south and actually lived next door to a disturbed older kid who raised dobermen dogs to fight and kill.
that's the whole point, isn't it? and as you may have noticed the people who do exactly anything are doing it already despite it "being wrong", so "freedom" wouldn't change anything except for those who are now restrained, i.e. the rest of us.VideoFred wrote:Some people would do anything if others would not tell them it is wrong.
It ain't pretty seeing wild animals fighting, but there are certain rules in nature. The animals are doing this by instinct, not for fun.mattias wrote:
anybody seen wild animals fight? it ain't pretty, so the reason people are against domestic animals fighting must have something to do with the slavery aspect, right? that's exactly what i'm saying.
/matt
No, he isn´t. Just think how boring it would be to have no work. It would mean no vacation, no real weekends (that matter), no need to look forward to holidays.mattias wrote:they do for sure, but "we"? are you joking? ;-)
/matt
that's true except for the just. my nihilist world view often clashes with other people's, hence the need to discuss, but i sure use a fair bit of playing stupid and acting the devils advocate to make things more interesting. i think more people should. it's really no fun discussing with politically correct hypocrites.Uppsala BildTeknik wrote:I think you are just looking for a fight Mattias, just wanting to argue.
that's exactly what i'm doing, unlike most people whose most outrageous political demands are "peace on earth" and "i want everybody to be happy". how much thought have you been putting into animal rights lately? i don't know the answer but statistically there's a good chance your opinion is based on moral codes, emotions, and even worse propaganda, rather than thought.If that isn´t so, you realllllly need to think twice man.