Mini disc - good for field sound recording?

Post by **richard p. t.** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 2:13 pm

I havn't ever used a mini disc redorder, but they are really cheap now on ebay. I have been using a dat on loan off and on with great results, but its owner (it used to be 50/50 but I sold my share back to the other guy when I was at university!!) likes to keep hold of it and only lets it out in short bursts.

Are these mini disc recorders any good for live sound recording? I have been reading a lot of reviews on a lot of sites, but few on those sites use them for anything but playing music.

The late model HD minidisc recorders can be purchased on the net for Aus$150 which is impossibly good.

Post by **sunrise** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 2:32 pm

You should look for a recorder that can record uncompressed in at least 48kHz (DAT-quality). Also look for storage possibility and possibilty to connect directly to PC.

You should also take into consideration what microphone you are going to use. Do you need phanton power and balanced input?

I found the M-audio Microtrack 24/96 best value for money in the budget scale. It's also very small and portable. Has s/pdif input for digital mixers and is around the size of a mobile phone.

michael

Post by **Evan Kubota** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 6:52 pm

"I found the M-audio Microtrack 24/96 best value for money in the budget scale. It's also very small and portable. Has s/pdif input for digital mixers and is around the size of a mobile phone."

I agree - I've researched this quite a bit and the only competitors are the Edirol R1 and the soon to be released R09. The R1 is $100 more and lacks 1/4" balanced inputs and only does 44.1 kHz WAV. The R09 is coming in a couple months and will have 96 kHz but not balanced inputs. Estimated price is $400 street. The M-Audio can be had for $335. The firmware is supposedly somewhat rough but updates are coming. I'm going to wait a few weeks and probably buy the M-Audio...

Post by **audadvnc** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 7:23 pm

Just about any digital audio recording device can make halfway decent recordings nowadays. The problem with cheap gear is that it's so flimsy and uses unreliable 1/8" connectors. Production equipment use XLR connectors because they can be moved, jounced around, and survive in the field, whereas an 1/8" plug will break (and perhaps the circuit board mounted jack in the unit also) the first time somebody kicks the cable. Trust me on this, it's happened to me.

So use sturdy gear, and treat it like glass, and it will last for years, or buy cheap plastic recorders and knock them about and watch 'em fail when you can least afford it.

Post by **flatwood** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:11 pm

audadvnc wrote:.... buy cheap plastic recorders and knock them about and watch 'em fail when you can least afford it.

Better yet, buy two!!!

Post by **paul** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:18 pm

he M-Audio can be had for $335

I haven't seen them for under 400 euro's around europe, while $ 335,- would be under 300 euro's here!! I hate that!

Paul

Post by **Evan Kubota** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:51 pm

"So use sturdy gear, and treat it like glass, and it will last for years, or buy cheap plastic recorders and knock them about and watch 'em fail when you can least afford it."

Or use cheap plastic gear and treat it carefully and it'll last for quite a long time ;)

Obviously top-end stuff is superior in any field but not everyone has $1000 to spend on a timecode DAT recorder. None of my cameras cost even half that much.

Post by **T-Scan** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:54 pm

I mention it all the time... The HiMD minidisc recorders that came out last year record uncompressed 16bit audio. USB upload and fits in your shirt pocket for around $250.

Post by **Scotness** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 10:44 pm

If used a properly a minidisc is fine - if you have the money and access to an uncompressed method then just on principal use that - but otherwise the minidsic will be fine -- as long as you treat it carefully and don't wobble the input jack - and get a proper breakout box to go from xlr to the minijack if you're using a powered mic - but otherwise it will be fine.

If you're worried that people are going to be walking out of your film saying "gee I was really worried about the psycoacoustic audio codec - why couldn't they have just used linear pulse code modulation instead of adaptive transform acoustic coding" then your film's got other issues you need to look at first.

Scot

Post by **Arislan** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 12:42 am

Evan Kubota wrote: Obviously top-end stuff is superior in any field but not everyone has $1000 to spend on a timecode DAT recorder. None of my cameras cost even half that much.

It depends, are you shooting as a hobby or is it a professional job, or whatever....if I were going to make a serious feature I'd have no choice but to buy either a tascam da-p1 or a nagra 4.2

Post by **T-Scan** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 6:15 am

That's why I keep preaching that the HiMD is the most practical sound device for S8 that you could hope for. Like Evan suggested, who the hell is going to spend over a G on audio gear for your $200 camera. If your project is that serious, then rent your audio gear along with an S16 camera. Besides quality, the one thing that makes HiMD compatable with S8 is extreme portability.

Post by **Evan Kubota** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 6:19 am

HiMD isn't that cheap for Mac users, though. The only current model that's Mac compatible is close to $400. Might as well get a Microtrack and enjoy 24 bit/96 kHz recording...

Post by **richard p. t.** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 10:11 am

Thanks all for responses.
Well I think I will go for a 'new' HD mini disc as opposed to a secondhand net mini disk. The microtrack 24/96 explains why the mini disc is old hat.
This is primarily for use gathering wild sounds on my own anyway, so durability is not too big an issue.

Good points about the xlr jacks vs mini jacks. Think I'll build a carry case with xlr jacks on the outside (did this with the dat recorder when I had it. That seamed to work well).

Cheers!
Richard

Post by **mattias** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:02 am

i use a sharp md recorder. all sharps have mic inputs with really good preamps that even distort gracefully when overdriven. sort of like a poor man's limiter compared to the clipping of most. and all have manual gain that can be adjusted during recording. i currently use an mt290h but all the sharps seem very similar. oh, and here's the best part: you can find them for nothing. mine was $100 new including tax. i'd also recommend the m-audio, a dat or similar if you have that kind of cash. on the productions where i do i like to hire a sound guy instead and they often come with gear.

/matt

Post by **Dave Anderson** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 4:21 pm

I just picked up a Marantz PMD660. It's a solid-state recorder that uses CF cards and will record at 48kHz and 44.1kHz uncompressed. There are XLR outs as well. It runs around $500.

After using a Sony MD for a couple of years, I think this setup produces much better sound. Although the MD is compact and has many advantages as well.

Review:
http://www.transom.org/tools/recording_ ... md660.html